SB 9.18.22 – Accepting Our Destiny

Giriraj Swami: We read from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Canto Nine, Chapter Eighteen, “King Yayāti Regains His Youth,” Text Twenty-Two.

TEXT 22

yad idaṁ kūpa-magnāyā
bhavato darśanaṁ mama
na brāhmaṇo me bhavitā
hasta-grāho mahā-bhuja
kacasya bārhaspatyasya
śāpād yam aśapaṁ purā

TRANSLATION

Because of falling in the well, I met you. Indeed, this has been arranged by providence. After I cursed Kaca, the son of the learned scholar Bṛhaspati, he cursed me by saying that I would not have a brāhmaṇa for a husband. Therefore, O mighty-armed one, there is no possibility of my becoming the wife of a brāhmaṇa.

PURPORT by Srila Prabhupada

Kaca, the son of the learned celestial priest Bṛhaspati, had been a student of Śukrācārya, from whom he had learned the art of reviving a man who has died untimely. This art, called mṛta-sañjīvanī, was especially used during wartime. When there was a war, soldiers would certainly die untimely, but if a soldier’s body was intact, he could be brought to life again by this art of mṛta-sañjīvanī. This art was known to Śukrācārya and many others, and Kaca, the son of Bṛhaspati, became Śukrācārya’s student to learn it.

COMMENT

So, when we preach, we often make the point that when the soul leaves the body, the body is dead and there is nothing we can do to bring the body back to life, because the soul has gone. But we find in the Puranas many stories of persons who have died, or in other words, whose souls left their bodies, but have been brought back to life. So, if one knows the science or the technique, he can actually bring the soul back into the body after the soul has left the body.

Once, I asked Srila Prabhupada about modern scientific endeavor to create life in the test room. I gave the example of such instances from Vedic history, and Srila Prabhupada confirmed the fact that if they could create the proper conditions for the soul to enter, the soul could enter, and they could appear to have created life, but actually, they would not have created life. They would have just created the situation in which the soul would have entered. So, life cannot exist without the soul, but it is a fact that if one knows the technique or science, he can create the situation where the soul will enter, and therefore, one can bring a dead person back to life and conceivably, one can also create a new life.

But still, we challenge the scientists because they don’t know the science. They don’t have the technique. So, we challenge the scientists, “You say life is created by a combination of chemicals. So, if I give you the chemicals, can you create life?” Srila Prabhupada was very pleased and proud of His Holiness Bhakti Svarupa Damodara Maharaja when he challenged one nobel prize winning scientist who had given a big discourse about life arises out of some chemical soup of ammonia, carbon dioxide, and one other thing, nitrogen, oxygen.

He is [Unintelligible 00:07:04], by the way. We don’t mind. So, the scientist gave a big discourse with so many diagrams and formulas, basically saying that life arose from these three chemicals. So, His Holiness Bhakti Svarupa Damodara Maharaja challenged the scientist after the lecture, “If we give you these three chemicals, can you create life?” And the scientist replied, “We cannot say.”

So, there was once a big atheist in Sri Lanka named Dr. Karaur. He made a challenge that proved that God exists. So, one of Prabhupada’s disciples in Sri Lanka, he met the challenge, proved that God doesn’t exist. Then, he made a point, following Srila Prabhupada, “You claim to be so advanced in scientific knowledge. Why don’t you take an egg, analyze the composition of the shell, the composition of the white, the composition of the yellow, synthesize it in the laboratory, and create a chicken?”

Of course, Dr. Karaur could not meet such a challenge, and so, our godbrother said, “The chicken is a greater scientist than you because the chicken can create an egg that can create another chicken. And all these three little things; the shell, the egg white, and the egg yolk, which you can easily analyze chemically in the laboratory and synthesize, you can’t do. So, the chicken is a greater scientist than you.”

But actually, if one knew the technique, he could bring a dead body back to life. He could even create a situation where the soul can enter a new body, but they don’t know that technique. So, we can challenge them.

PURPORT (continued)

This art was known to Śukrācārya and many others, and Kaca, the son of Bṛhaspati, became Śukrācārya’s student to learn it. Devayānī desired to have Kaca as her husband, but Kaca, out of regard for Śukrācārya, looked upon the guru’s daughter as a respectable superior and therefore refused to marry her.

COMMENT

So, he was actually being very respectful when he saw, “She is the daughter of my teacher, of my guru. How can I marry her? She is respectable to me. She is worshipable. How can I marry her?”

PURPORT (continued)

Devayānī angrily cursed Kaca by saying that although he had learned the art of mṛta-sañjīvanī from her father, it would be useless.

COMMENT

So, there is an English saying, “Hell hath no fury like a woman’s scorn.” So, Devayani became furious when Kaca refused. So, she cursed him, “You have so much respect for my father because he was your teacher. Well, I will show you. Whatever you learn from my father will become useless, nullified.”

PURPORT (continued)

When cursed in this way, Kaca retaliated by cursing Devayānī never to have a husband who was a brāhmaṇa. Because Devayānī liked Yayāti, who was a kṣatriya, she requested him to accept her as his bona fide wife. Although this would be pratiloma-vivāha, a marriage between the daughter of a high family and the son of a lower family, she explained that this arrangement was made by providence.

COMMENT

So, generally, in Vedic culture, marriages were arranged between boys and girls of similar status; their birth, their culture, their education, their qualification, their natures were all supposed to be all comparable, and then the match was arranged. But sometimes it had happened that a boy of a higher caste would marry a girl of a lower caste, and that was not so bad.

But here, we have a girl of a higher caste marrying a boy of a lower caste, and that is considered worse because the husband is supposed to be the authority for the wife. He should be, in principle, more intelligent and more qualified than her. So, if, for example, the husband is a brahman and the wife is a kshatriya, the brahman can easily act as a husband for the kshatriya or for the daughter of the kshatriya, but if the lady is more intelligent or more qualified than the husband, then how will the husband be able to act as her authority and guide her?

So, this arrangement is pratiloma, because a kshatriya was marrying a daughter of a brahman, but still, Devayani encouraged the king to accept her because of the fact that she had been cursed not to have a brahman as her husband. So, she was saying, “Anyways, I can’t have a brahman as a husband. So, you have already rescued me. Well, you have already taken my hand. So, you should become my husband and no one else.” And she said that this arrangement was made by providence. It is mentioned in the present verse and in the previous verse also, very explicitly.

TEXT 21

eṣa īśa-kṛto vīra
sambandho nau na pauruṣaḥ

COMMENT

She said, “This arrangement has been made by providence, not by any human being.” So, what actually is providence? We find another verse in the First Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam where the sages in Naimiṣaraṇya appreciate Suta Gosvami, “We think that your goodness has been met by us by the will of providence just to accept you as the captain of the ship for those who are desiring to cross over the difficult ocean of Kali, which deteriorates all the good qualities of a human being.”

So, what actually is providence? Two days ago, one journalist met me, and she was writing an article about destiny, and she wanted to interview me. So, what actually is destiny? So, Srila Prabhupada has explained that destiny is just the result of our past activities. Yes, for example, a criminal may commit a crime. He may be sentenced to three years in jail. So, we can say, “He is destined to three years in jail,” but why? He is destined to spend three years in jail because of his own activities. So, his term of sentence is the result of his own activities.

Sri Sri Radha-Rasabihari ki jaya! Srila Prabhupada ki jaya!

But even if one is destined to spend three years in jail, he still has free will. By his misuse of his independence, he committed a crime and now he has to suffer the reaction. But even while suffering the reaction, he has free will, and even in prison, he can use his time in a good way or in a not so good way. So, we always have free will and our destiny is actually the creation of our previous activities performed with our own free will. But once we perform a certain action, we are bound to suffer a certain reaction, and that we cannot escape.

Just like if someone touches fire, he will be burned. It is the law of nature, the law of cause and effect. So, we should not think, Well, I will touch fire and I will pray to Krishna, so I won’t get burned. Of course, if one is fully surrendered to Krishna, he won’t pray for anything material, and Krishna can do anything if He wants. But ordinarily, we are bound by cause and effect, and if we touch fire, we will be burned. We cannot expect Krishna to save us from the reaction.

Another example, someone buys a ticket to Calcutta. He gets on a plane to go to Calcutta. So, once he is on the plane, he is destined to go to Calcutta, but he got the ticket from his own free will. But still, now he is destined to go to Calcutta. But even on the plane, he has free will, and on the plane, he can eat meat and drink alcohol, or he can chant Hare Krishna and read Bhagavad-gītā. He has free will which he can exercise while enjoying or suffering the results of his past activities.

Now, this fact actually has a very deep significance of application for devotees. And Narada Muni, in the First Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and Prahlada Maharaja, in the Seventh Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, both gave the same instruction, that nobody wants problems, nobody wants to suffer. Nobody comes to the temple to pray to the Lord, “Please give me problems.” We want to get rid of our problems, we don’t want problems.

So, the Bhāgavatam says just as problems come, just as misery comes without our making any effort to get it, similarly, happiness will also come without our making any effort to get it. Why do miseries come without us making any effort? Because we are destined to suffer because of our past activities. So, just as we are destined to suffer to a certain degree by our past activities, we are also destined to enjoy a certain amount by our past activities. So, just as the miseries come without us making any effort, the happiness will also come.

Therefore, why should we endeavor fruitlessly to escape miseries? The miseries will come as they are due to us. And similarly, why should we endeavor to increase our material happiness? Our material happiness will also come to us as destined by our past activities. So, the conclusion is that we should not waste time either trying to increase our happiness or decrease our distress, but we should use our time and energy and intelligence wholly and solely to advance in Krishna consciousness, to engage in the service of the Lord. And if we make an effort to increase our happiness or decrease our distress, we are actually wasting our time because we cannot change our destiny. We can’t increase our happiness or decrease our distress.

So, not only are we wasting our time trying to achieve something that cannot be achieved, but we are missing the best opportunity to use our time for the best purpose, for devotional service to Lord Krishna. But we are so prone to act like ordinary, ignorant, fruitive workers, trying to create a situation where we will be more happy or less miserable, but we cannot do it. We are bound to suffer our destiny. Srila Prabhupada used to quote a saying in Indian language, that even if you go to Calcutta, your forehead will go with you, because one’s destiny is supposed to be inscribed in the lines of one’s forehead. And even now, in India, when people want to lament their bad luck, they go like this, “Oh! I’m so unfortunate.”

So, during previous times, just like now, of course, now Bombay is almost like London or New York, but still, there are people, they think, Oh! If I could just go to London, if I could just go to New York, or just go to Los Angeles. So then, the people in the villages of India used to think, Oh! If I could just go to Calcutta. Calcutta is such a big city. There are so many opportunities for making money and enjoying life. So, they would all try to come to Calcutta like some people try to go to Europe or America.

So, the saying was, “Even if you go to Calcutta, your forehead will go with you,” meaning your destiny will go with you. You can’t escape your destiny. And I’ve seen that sometimes people from India go to America and they end up working in low-grade restaurants, not even as waiters, sometimes as a dishwasher, because if their destiny is that, that destiny will go with them even if they are in Baltimore or Houston.

So, we should not pursue the false hope of increasing our happiness or decreasing our distress by material means. We should accept whatever is destined to us by our past activities and tolerate. If some misery comes, we should tolerate. Even if some good fortune comes, we should tolerate. We shouldn’t become overly morose in misery, and we shouldn’t become overly elated in happiness, but we should see that our destiny is changing just like the seasons change, and we tolerate.

Spring is followed by summer, summer is followed by autumn, autumn is followed by winter. We may think that spring is very pleasing, but then summer will come and it will be too hot in India. But then, autumn will come and it will become cool again, and we’ll feel comfortable. But then, winter will come and winter will be too cold. In North India, summer is too hot and winter is too cold, but we can’t do anything about it. So, we have to tolerate and go on with our spiritual duties.

Srila Prabhupada used to quote the saying that even in the coldest winter, one has to take bath, and even in the hottest summer, one has to cook. So, we cannot avoid our duties, “Oh! It’s too cold. I’m not going to take a bath,” or, “It’s too hot. I’m not going to cook.” We have to do our duty and tolerate.

So, that is destiny, providence, but the sages at Naimiṣaraṇya made the statement, “We think that your goodness is met by us by the will of providence to accept you as the captain of the ship for those desiring to cross the difficult ocean of Kali, the dangerous ocean of Kali.”

So, what is that providence? Is that providence karma? That providence is not karma because all the scriptures declare that one cannot get bhakti or the association of bhaktas by any amount of material pious activity. One can dig wells, feed poor people, and open schools. One can engage in so many material pious activities, but no amount of material pious activity can bring one to devotional service or to the association of pure devotees. So, what is it that brings us to devotional service? What is that providence, “We think your goodness is met by us by providence.”? In Caitanya-caritāmṛta, Lord Chaitanya explains

TEXT 151

brahmāṇḍa bhramite kona bhāgyavān jīva

guru-kṛṣṇa-prasāde pāya bhakti-latā-bīja

COMMENT

When a fortunate living entity, after wandering through so many universes and so many species of life, becomes fortunate, he gets the seed of devotional service by the mercy of guru and Krishna. So, again, what is that fortune? Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura explains, as quoted in Caitanya-caritāmṛta, that the fortune that brings devotional service is not material pious activities. He explains that there are three kinds of pious activities that lead to good fortune in different ways. He said, “One type of pious activity leads to material elevation, to heavenly planets. One type of materialist material bias activity leads to liberation. One kind of pious activity leads to devotional service.”

So, what is the pious activity that makes one fortunate to receive the seed of devotional service? Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura and all the scriptures and authorities say that the pious activity that leads to devotional service is rendering service unknowingly to devotees. It is called, in some places, ajñāta-sukṛti. For example, Srila Prabhupada came to America. People had no idea about Krishna, what to speak of devotees of Krishna, but people met Srila Prabhupada and somehow, they found some sympathy for him and they wanted to serve him.

There is a story. Srila Prabhupada gave a lecture in one hall in Manhattan, and he sat down next to one man at the front of the hall. The man didn’t even know that Srila Prabhupada was the speaker. Then, after some time, Srila Prabhupada stood up, walked down the stage and gave the lecture, and he was all alone and he wanted to sell his books.

So, somehow, he knew that man. He sat next to that man and he asked that man to help him. So, the man helped him. So, the man probably had no idea what is a pure devotee of Krishna, but without knowing, he rendered some service to a pure devotee of Krishna, and such service accumulates and makes one fortunate, creates one’s good fortune to come to devotional service and actually, associate systematically with pure devotees.

So, we should try to engage people in service somehow or other. Of course, if we can explain the science of Krishna and they accept the principles, that is best, but even if they don’t understand the principles, let them do some service for Srila Prabhupada and they will benefit. Srila Prabhupada built this temple. So many people come to this temple, and if they just appreciate, like we heard the other day, if they just appreciate how beautiful the Deity is, how nicely decorated and how clean the temple is, they benefit just by appreciating. Srila Prabhupada says if someone looks out his window and sees some devotees passing on the street and the person thinks, “Oh! They seem to be very nice,” if he just appreciates, even if he doesn’t do anything more, he makes spiritual advancement. So, what to speak of actually rendering service to a devotee.

When Srila Prabhupada first came to New York, he would walk down the street in the morning and he would greet the people on the sidewalk by saying, “Good morning!” So, one disciple asked Srila Prabhupada, “Why are you saying good morning? Why don’t you say Hare Krishna?” And Srila Prabhupada replied, “If I were to say Hare Krishna, they would be confused, they wouldn’t know how to respond. But when I say good morning, then they reciprocate and they also wish me good morning, and their devotional service begins.”

So, somehow or other, we should see how to engage people in devotional service, even unknowingly, and that will become a great spiritual asset to them, which will increase. Srila Prabhupada gave the example; they come to the temple, they see the Deities. So, one cent in the account. They offer obeisances to the Deity, one cent. They take caraṇāmṛta, they take prasāda, they chant the holy name. So, one cent, one cent, one cent, one cent, and it’s all accumulating in the account. And then Srila Prabhupada said, “One day they’ll have a hundred dollars and then they’ll actually be able to do something.”

So, even if someone cannot directly take to devotional service in Krishna consciousness, let him do something for the cause of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Srila Prabhupada, and it will help him one day develop that good fortune of meeting a pure devotee and getting the seed of devotional service.

So, when the sages say to Suta Gosvami, “We think your goodness is met by us by the will of providence,” we could here almost equate the will of providence with the mercy of Krishna. By the mercy of Krishna, one gets guru, and by the guidance of guru, one gets Krishna’s service. So, they were qualified and Krishna knew their sincerity. So, Krishna arranged for a qualified devotee to speak Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam to them. So, that is actually the mercy of Krishna, and the mercy of Krishna is certainly beyond any material pious or impious activities.

Just like yesterday, it was Nityananda Prabhu’s appearance day. Jagai and Madhai were so fallen, so degraded, so hostile to Nityananda Prabhu, but still, Nityananda Prabhu was kind to them. Even though they blasphemed Him and physically injured Him, He didn’t take offense. He was fixed in His determination or desire to give them mercy, to engage them in Krishna consciousness.

Generally, the devotee will speak to persons who are inquisitive, who are eager to hear. As Lord Krishna says in Bhagavad-gītā, one should not speak to the envious or to those who are not austere or devoted, but still, the mercy of the devotee is such that he can extend mercy even to the most fallen criminal, even if the person is antagonistic towards him, hostile towards him, offensive towards him, like Nityananda Prabhu.

So, ultimately, devotional service and the mercy of the devotee is free, but still, if someone has engaged in pious activities, if he has become free from sinful activities and especially, if he is eager to hear, he will naturally be the recipient of Krishna’s mercy in the form of the association of pure devotees, who will speak the message of Krishna. But still, if the devotee wants to give mercy even to someone very fallen and sinful, he can. Like Narada also with Valmiki. Valmiki wanted to kill Narada. Narada was still merciful to him and engaged him, somehow or other, in chanting the holy name.

So, that should be our mood, to give mercy to everyone whether they are nice to us or not. Of course, as preachers, we distinguish, and especially, we give mercy to innocent persons, we avoid envious persons. But very high-grade devotees, they are so merciful and powerful that they are ready to give mercy even to people who are ready to injure them or kill them, and that is their mercy. So, whatever our karma may be, as it is said, mercy is a higher principle than justice. So, whatever may be due to us by our past activities, we have to suffer materially, but spiritually, we can always get the mercy of the devotee. And we, who are trying to become devotees, should also try to give mercy to everyone as far as possible, whatever their qualification or disqualification may be, and that will please Nityananda Prabhu.

In one lecture, Srila Prabhupada said that we cannot approach Radha and Krishna without the mercy of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. And the way to get the mercy of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is to get the mercy of Nityananda Prabhu, and the way to get the mercy of Nityananda Prabhu is to approach persons who are like Jagai and Madhai. So, that is our service, and that is our technique, that by approaching the most fallen souls like Jagai and Madhai, we get the mercy of Nityananda Prabhu. And getting the mercy of Nityananda Prabhu, everything else will follow automatically.

Sri Nityananda Prabhu ki jaya! Srila Prabhupada ki jaya! Nitai-Gaura premānande!

Any questions or comments? It is the auspicious appearance day of the portable microphone so that the audience can ask questions in the microphone. Hare Krishna.

Devotee: Hare Krishna. [Unintelligible 00:40:22].

Giriraj Swami: Well, generally, we say that the mercy of the spiritual master for the devotee is the instruction of the spiritual master. It is true that mercy can come in the form of prayer also, that the devotee will pray for the well-being of the candidate. But generally, if we want to give mercy to someone, we will give him instructions in the science of Krishna consciousness, so that by following the instructions, he can be elevated. And at the same time, we can pray to Krishna to be merciful, pray to Srila Prabhupada, to our spiritual master, to be merciful.

Like Vasudeva Datta, he prayed for the deliverance of every living entity in the universe. He actually told Lord Chaitanya, “Whatever their sinful reactions are, I will take on my head and let them all be liberated. Let them all go back home, back to Godhead.” And Lord Chaitanya was so moved by the prayer of Vasudeva Datta, His whole body began to tremble and tears began to flow from His eyes, and He embraced him and then He said, “Krishna has no other desire than to fulfill the desire of the pure devotee. So, if you desire someone’s deliverance, Krishna will fulfill your desire even without your having to suffer the reactions for their sinful activities.”

And then, Lord Chaitanya quoted one verse from the Tenth Canto of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, where the personified Vedas pray to the Supreme Lord, “Just as by Your will, someone can be placed in the clutches of maya, similarly, by Your will, if You desire, You can release someone from the clutches of maya. So, please be merciful.” So, the devotees can pray to the Lord to be merciful, and the Lord, desiring to fulfill the desire of the devotee, will be merciful.

I shouldn’t just talk about myself, but in my initiation letter, Srila Prabhupada wrote, “So, I marked it in your presence,” this is referring to when I first met Srila Prabhupada, “And I prayed to Krishna that this good soul may become aware of the value of Krishna consciousness.” So, even if someone has no qualification but if the pure devotee wants to show mercy and prays to Krishna to give mercy, then anyone without any qualification can be uplifted. But along with prayers, the pure devotee will also give instructions, and the instructions. . . That I can follow your instructions.

So, Srila Prabhupada told a little story, gave a little example, that a man has fallen in the bottom of a well and a person comes. He sees him in the well and he hands down a rope to the man in the well, and the man in the well is praying, “Please give me your mercy that my fingers will curl around the rope.” So, Srila Prabhupada was saying, “The person, he is giving mercy by sending down the rope and he is ready to pull you up. All you have to do is hold onto the rope. You can’t ask him to make your fingers curl around the rope.”

So, similarly, the spiritual master’s mercy is he gives you instructions and all you have to do is try to follow the instructions. You don’t even have to be completely successful or perfect. You just have to try to follow the instructions, and then the spiritual master will pull you out of the well of material existence and engage you in the lotus feet of Krishna and service at the lotus feet of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.

So, Srila Prabhupada appreciated that prayer, “Please give me your mercy so that I may follow your instructions.” But internally, we know that great devotees do pray to Krishna to give mercy to fallen souls, and at the same time, they instruct them in devotional service. And if the devotees or the candidates just try to follow the instructions, they will be delivered by the mercy of guru and Krishna.

Devotee: Hare Krishna. [Unintelligible 00:46:56].

Giriraj Swami: Well, destiny and karma are basically two sides of the same coin. Karma means cause and effect. So, one’s karma is the cause of a reaction, which is the effect. So, we can say, “I have bad karma,” which means I did some bad activities, now I’m getting bad reactions. Or he has good karma, that means he did some good activities and he is getting good reactions. So, destiny really means the result of our activities, or the effect of some cause.

Srila Prabhupada told the story of the foolish man who was sitting on the limb of a tree, and he was sawing the limb from where the limb joined the trunk of the tree. So, somebody on the ground said, “Don’t keep sawing the tree. If you keep sawing the tree, you are going to fall down.” But the man was so foolish, he kept sawing, and obviously, the limb that he was sitting on became disconnected from the tree and he fell down. So then, he thought, Oh! Who was that seer? He could see into the future, but actually, he could see the sequence of cause and effect. So, that is karma. Karma is just the sequence of cause and effect, and our destiny is just the effect of some cause for the effect that we did by our own free will.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:49:01].

Giriraj Swami: No, because of destiny, we are born in a particular family, we have a particular configuration of senses, mind, intelligence, and so on. We are born in a particular community, a particular nation, and so on. But what we do in that situation depends on our free will. Someone may be born in a very elevated family, but he may become degraded. Someone may be born in a low family and he may become elevated.

When Srila Prabhupada was here in 1977, there was an article in the newspaper, I forget the figures, let’s say, “Ten million Harijans look for a new Messiah.” And the idea was that the previous Messiah for the Harijans was Dr. Ambedkar, and since Dr. Ambedkar passed away, the Harijans were looking for a new Messiah. So, Tamal Krishna Goswami showed the article to Srila Prabhupada, and Srila Prabhupada said, “We must reply to the article.” And Srila Prabhupada was making the point that people are not kept down because of their low birth, and the example is that of Dr. Ambedkar himself. Dr. Ambedkar himself was born in a very low-grade family, but he rose to great prominence in India. So, who stopped him? No one stopped him.

So, if one has the quality, he can rise up even from an obscure background, and if someone doesn’t have the quality, even he can fall down from an exalted position. So, Srila Prabhupada was saying that nobody can keep us down or keep us up. And of course, we had the idea that Srila Prabhupada should become the Messiah for the Harijans because he could actually elevate them by his instructions and his mercy, not just champion their cause in a material way.

When I was in Madras, the chief justice of the high court was taking a lot of interest in Krishna consciousness, and when Srila Prabhupada came to Madras, he would personally guide me how to deal with him. So, at on stage, Srila Prabhupada had raised the point that in Madras or in Tamil Nadu, there was a great conflict, a struggle between the brahmans and the non-brahmans, and he said, “I think that Mr. Viruswami is not a brahman.” Actually, I think he was a kshatriya by birth. So, Srila Prabhupada said, “In Madras, the government spent so much money on building nice apartments for the slum dwellers, but what was the result? The result was that the slum dwellers would rent out the nice apartments and use the money to buy wine and beadies and whatever else, and stay in the slums.”

So, Srila Prabhupada was saying, “You cannot elevate a person by material, external means. If their consciousness is such as to keep them in the slum, they’ll stay in the slums. They won’t even live in the new apartment. They’ll rent out the new apartment and use the money to buy intoxicants. So, it’s a failure. If we want to elevate people, we have to elevate their consciousness by Krishna consciousness.” So, he was saying, “I should tell the chief justice that we can make him and anyone else into a brahman. They don’t have to fight with the brahmans. We’ll make them brahmans. They just have to follow our guidance.”

So, that is the real way to make Harijans, real people of God, elevating them by spiritual process. And that is what Srila Prabhupada’s mission was, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu’s mission was.

Yes, Prabhu? Last question.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:54:17].

Giriraj Swami: Is the free will of a person influenced by his karma or his destiny? We always have free will, but we are influenced by the modes of nature. So, if someone is born more or less in the mode of ignorance, he’ll be inclined to sleep, to take intoxicants, and so on. If someone is born more under the mode of passion, they’ll be inclined to work hard and achieve things. If someone is born more in the mode of goodness, he’ll be more inclined towards study, towards art, philosophy, culture, and so on.

But still, we have free will. We can choose to associate with the mode of ignorance more, or the mode of passion more, or the mode of goodness more, or pure devotees. And that’s why the scriptures always recommend, one should associate with devotees and not materialistic persons, because whatever one’s conditioning is, whatever one’s karma is, whatever one’s association has been, if one associates with devotees and serves devotees, he can be elevated from any position in the material modes of nature to the transcendental position of pure devotional service.

So, ultimately, although the influences of the modes are there, everyone does have free will to associate with pure devotees, and if he associates with pure devotees, he can be elevated above any material mode of nature and engage in the transcendental loving services.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:56:22].

Giriraj Swami: Now, I said that will be the last question, and we don’t want to go too. . .

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:56:38].

Giriraj Swami: And on top of it, the school is coming to have their prayers. So, I’ll answer separately.

Sri Sri Radha-Rasabihari ki jaya! Sri Sri Gaura-Nitai ki jaya! Srila Prabhupada ki jaya!

Devotee: Giriraj Swami Maharaja ki jaya!