Srila Prabhupada’s Alternative

Giriraj Swami: Of course, it was our great fortune to meet Srila Prabhupada and hear from him about Krishna, that Krishna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. And that was Srila Prabhupada’s main mission, to introduce Krishna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and to help us understand that we are eternal servants of Krishna, and that the best way to realize our eternal relationship with Krishna in the present age of Kali is to chant the holy names of Krishna, especially the Hare Krishna maha-mantra.

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare

Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare.

And you could say that he planted the seed of bhakti or offered the seed of bhakti to anyone and everyone. And some fortunate souls, Gurudasa Prabhu was one of the early pioneers, and then others, myself, then still others, were able to accept that seed of bhakti. And then, after giving us the seed, Srila Prabhupada watered it by singing songs about Krishna, by explaining the philosophy of Krishna consciousness from the Bhagavad-gītā, by telling us the pastimes of Krishna, and he nurtured that seed. And he did everything for us. When you plant a seed and water it, you also have to be careful of weeds. Weeds may grow up alongside the creeper, and the weeds may actually resemble the creeper, and it takes someone with an expert eye to distinguish the creeper of devotional service from other creepers that may sprout up. Srila Prabhupada did that.

It happened that individual devotees and even numbers of devotees became confused about what pure devotional service is because we are always subject to other influences. And being influenced by different ideas, we could become confused, and we could mistake something as being pure devotional service or part of pure devotional service that is not pure devotional service. And if you have a garden, then you will want to put a fence around it, especially when there are creatures lurking about that might enter the garden and wreak havoc. This metaphor, by the way, was given by Lord Chaitanya in His instructions to Rupa Gosvami. So, Lord Chaitanya gave the example of the bhakti-latā-bīja in his instructions to Rupa Gosvami, and Srila Prabhupada has explained in his purports more of the significance of the metaphor, but the seed is the original idea, and the methods of devotional service. The water by which the seed is nourished is chanting and hearing about Krishna, the weeds that may grow up alongside the devotional creeper are material desires. There are basically two categories of material desires, broad categories; the desire for bhukti, which means material enjoyment, and the desire for mukti, which means impersonal liberation, merging and becoming one with the Supreme, which is generally in the form of an impersonal spiritual light called the brahmajyoti.

And then there is behavior that is considered inappropriate for a devotee. And Lord Chaitanya mentions six types, but there are so many. One is duplicitous behavior; a devotee should be simple. It is one of the basic characteristics of a devotee, saralata, simplicity. And another type of unwanted behavior is jīva-hiṁsā, violence towards other living entities, which in the gross sense would refer to killing animals and eating their flesh. According to scripture, everyone involved in the process of killing the animal is held responsible. The person who rears the animal, ultimately for slaughter, the person who slaughters the animal, the person who transports the flesh, the person who cooks the flesh, the person who serves it, and the person who eats it. Actually, the person who sells it is in there too. So, they are all considered part of that conspiracy.

It is just like if a gang robs a bank. So, only one person may physically take the money out of the safe, but the person behind the scenes who had the idea, who is not even at the scene of the crime, he is part of the conspiracy. The driver, he was just sitting in the vehicle, he didn’t come into the bank, he is also part of it. And the person who comes in the bank with a gun and threatens everyone, “If you move, we will kill you,” he is part of it. It is not just the person who physically takes the money from the safe. So, in the same way, everyone involved in the process of eating meat is part of the ‘conspiracy’ to kill some innocent animal for the sake of plundering the flesh from its body and consuming it. So, this is jīva-hiṁsā, violence towards other living entities.

It is, to me, a striking feature of California, that there are so many people conscious of the environment, conscious of the suffering of creatures. Recently, a devotee told me about an incident in Santa Barbara, I have a base in Santa Barbara, where some little creature, could it have been a jackal? Some little creature ended up on the road, no one could immediately identify it but it was obviously some baby rodent or some mammal. And the traffic stopped, people got out of their cars, they were looking at it, trying to identify it, trying to think what to do, how to save its life, and someone eventually identified it and figured out how to deal with it and picked it up and saved his life. So, this is very commendable to have that sort of consciousness that there is life, the soul, jiva, jīvātmā, there is life, there is a soul in other species of life.

But then, it also occurred to me, how many of these good people who stopped their cars to attend to this little baby mammal would not hesitate to go home and eat chunks of flesh of other mammals without even thinking about it? There is some sort of disconnection, that there is one side of them, if some little rodent is stranded, or I have seen it sometimes, a seal will get washed up on the beach, and so there is a whole department for dealing with marine mammals and you phone them and you tell them where the seal is and they try to come out and rescue the seal. And they have very sophisticated arrangements for taking care of selected species who form part of a world of sense gratification that appeals to them.

It has a little goodness to it, there is an element of goodness to it. But the basic idea is they are the center, every conditioned soul has the idea they are the center, and they see others as supporting cast in the drama of their lives. And they see the world around them as the set for their drama. So, in the drama of their lives, they want nice seals and dolphins and whales, they like that as part of the set. And little puppies and squirrels and birds, they like that as part of their set for the drama of their lives. So, there is no real philosophy, there is some sentiment, there is no real philosophy. And when it suits them, no problem, go to the good health food store and get some organic chicken. I probably shouldn’t have even said that, I definitely won’t say it anymore, but get organic flesh and cook it up and eat it. So, they have some good sentiments, but they don’t really have a clear philosophy.

Krishna gives in the Bhagavad-gītā, that we are not the body but the soul is the real living entity, and the body is just a machine that is operated by the soul. And the different species of life are different types of machines. Just like someone will drive a Ford, someone will drive a Chevrolet, someone will drive a Mercedes-Benz, someone will drive a Rolls-Royce. But that is just the machine. You are not the machine that you are in. One moment I might be in a little Toyota, the next minute I might be in a big Lexus, but I am still the same person. So, the soul is transmigrating through different forms of life, different bodies, but the soul remains the same. And although we have different machines or different dress, the body is also compared to a dress, but the person is the same.

Say this gentleman is wearing a red shirt, this one is wearing a white shirt, but you are not white, and he is not red. And it would be foolish to distinguish between the two of you on the basis of what color shirt you are wearing; red, white, gray, blue. It is just the dress, underneath they are all human beings. So, in the same way, these bodies that we are wearing, they are just like dress that we change. One day, we might be wearing white, the next day, red, the next day, black, and so on. But the soul is the same. And a devotee identifies with all living beings or living entities and wants to do good for all of them. And the best way to do good for them is to connect them with the Supreme Soul; that is yoga. The word yoga means to connect or link, and it really means, like the English word yoke, it comes from that. It means to connect with God. And when we do that, then we are happy, we are satisfied, and all of our problems are solved.

So, Srila Prabhupada was aware of this philosophy, he had this knowledge, and he came to a place where people were unaware of it, and offered it to them. And he felt that the principles that he was enunciating, especially in terms of personal conduct, were so different from the way of life that the people in America were following. He thought that no one will listen to him, that he will tell people, “No eating meat, fish, or eggs, no taking intoxicants, no gambling, no indulging in illicit sex,” and they will say, “Thank you very much, Swamiji, now you can go home,” that was what he thought would happen. But actually, there was a generation of young people who were searching. As Gurudasa Prabhu said, they were not satisfied. Prabhupada said about our generation that, “They rejected the stereotyped, materialistic way of life of their parents and grandparents.” So, we were looking for some alternative, and many people, the alternatives they found were very diverse, but we were fortunate to have, in that state of looking for an alternative, we were fortunate to find a proper guide like Srila Prabhupada. And that made all the difference. Otherwise, many of our generation became hippies.

And yes, Srila Prabhupada said that, “They had rejected the stereotyped, materialistic way of life, but they had no positive information about the beautiful life in Krishna consciousness,” and that is something that Srila Prabhupada gave us. He gave us information about it, and he gave us the experience of it, we experienced it in his person. He created a spiritual family around him, and anyone who entered the spiritual family, entered the orbit of the spiritual family could have the same experience of transcendental love and bliss. So, after remaining in the United States for about five years from 1965 to 1970, Srila Prabhupada had the idea to go back to India and introduce Krishna consciousness there. Of course, Krishna consciousness was already there, it is natural, but Srila Prabhupada perceived that the Indians were very eager to imitate the Westerners, imitate the Americans. So, he thought, Okay, these Indians, they want to imitate the Americans, so if the Americans take to Krishna consciousness, then the Indians who are so eager to imitate the Americans, they will also take to Krishna consciousness. And actually, it happened. The strategy worked. Because they took it for granted. Many people in India, they just took it for granted, “We are born in this, Krishna is in our blood, we are born in this, we know about this before you were even born.”

And I remember, this is one of the many striking things that I learned from Gurudasa, that I heard Gurudasa Prabhu say. Because sometimes, they would ask us, “Why did you take to Krishna consciousness? Why did you give up your families and your nation and your wealth to take to Krishna consciousness?” And Gurudasa Prabhu would say, “You obviously have not experienced what Krishna consciousness is, because if you had experienced it, you would not be asking this question.” And that is absolutely true, because one who is actually relished some of the sweet taste of Krishna consciousness, would never exchange it for the pale or confused taste of material life.

So, at this stage, because we are somewhat limited in time, I would like to share one or two experiences that I had with Srila Prabhupada that relate to things that Gurudasa Prabhu mentioned in his little talk. The idea that some intelligent, young men and women came forward to join Srila Prabhupada and assist him, and also the fact that my father tried to bribe me to leave Srila Prabhupada. So, in 1971, I had come to Calcutta, Srila Prabhupada was there, and my parents wanted to come and visit. What they really wanted to do was to get me back. And as Gurudasa Prabhu mentioned, I was very rigid, very strict. I remember when I first joined the Boston temple, I wouldn’t want to go out of the temple by myself because I thought if I didn’t have a devotee with me, I might be tempted to look at a billboard or something on the street, which would be maya, which would be a distraction from Krishna.

So, Srila Prabhupada knew my nature, he knew all of our natures. So, before my parents came, he said, “You should spend some time with your parents, it is your duty.” So, okay, I got the clear instruction, that was good. He also said that I should not accept anything from them for myself or they might think that we do not take care of our devotees. So, that was another instruction, okay. So, that was all clear. So they came, and eventually, they came to meet Srila Prabhupada in his room. And he was sitting in the same room, the same room is there, 3 Albert Road, Calcutta, and he was sitting as usual, behind his low table on an asana or simple cushion, and he was speaking to some devotees. And when my parents came in the room, he suddenly shifted the topic of the discussion to when he was a pharmacist in Allahabad, and Moltilal Nehru, who was the father of Jawaharlal Nehru, who became the first Prime Minister of India. Moltilal Nehru was his customer. But Srila Prabhupada said that he was a “Made in England” man. He said, if he had a medicine that had on the label ‘Made in England,’ and he had the exact same medicine from India, Moltilal Nehru, even if it cost five times as much or even ten times as much, but he would take the medicine that said ‘Made in England.’ So, that family was like that, they were, ‘Made in England’ people.

And Moltilal Nehru had other sons, but he considered Jawaharlal Nehru to be particularly useless. So, it was Gandhi’s principle to go to the families of India and say, “You have so many sons, give me one for my freedom movement.” So, Moltilal Nehru thought, Oh, this one is useless, we will give him, we will give him. [laughter] So, okay, he joined the freedom movement. And, Srila Prabhupada said how he was very successful in business, and how one astrologer had predicted that he would become the richest man in India. And, in a very subtle and sort of entertaining and interesting and amusing way, Srila Prabhupada was spinning this web of kṛṣṇa-kathā around my father. And in a very subtle and indirect way, attacking his prejudices, which were very common prejudices then, that America is superior to India or the West is superior to the East. And that big people in the material world like Jawaharlal Nehru are better than others, somehow superior, and they are the people we should follow, and all these types of illusions that people have. And in a very subtle and indirect way, he was attacking all of those misconceptions and illusions that could come in the way of a person’s accepting Krishna consciousness, accepting the guidance of people who are really qualified to give guidance, not the mundane leaders of the world.

So, like this, the talk went on, and then Srila Prabhupada, as I recall, sort of, let the other devotees go, leave the room, and it was just me, my father, my mother, and Srila Prabhupada’s sister whom we affectionately called Pishima, which I believe means the sister of the father, aunt, you could say. And she was also devotee; she had taken initiation, I think, first from Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura and second from one of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura’s disciples. So, it was us. And eventually, my father came to the point that he wanted me back, and then he came up with this idea of the money, that he wanted to give me a million dollars. He wanted to put it in a trust, and he wanted me to come back to America to sign the documents. So, Srila Prabhupada said, “Yes, he can sign, you can send the documents here and he will sign.” [laughter] It is like Gurudasa Prabhu said, “If you were looking for someone who was cool, Prabhupada was the coolest.” [laughter] So, if you are looking to challenge someone who was clever, Prabhupada was more clever than the cleverest. He said, “Yes, yes, you can send the documents, he will sign.”

And then, my father was a lawyer, and I didn’t realize it until later, when I visited my parents’ house in the suburbs of Chicago, but he had gotten a copy of the Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, and he had really scrutinizingly studied it and underlined portions and made notes in the margin. So, I didn’t have the background but he just said to Srila Prabhupada, “Well, I have read in your books that one can be Krishna conscious even at home. He doesn’t have to leave home to become Krishna conscious. So, what would be the problem if Glenn came home and was Krishna conscious at home?” So, Srila Prabhupada said, “Yes, that is true, but it is a question of association. If he stays at home, he won’t have the same association that he will have here,” which was very true, I don’t even think we had a temple, ISKCON had a temple in Chicago then. But he could see that my father was not happy with that answer. So, Srila Prabhupada said, “But if he wants to go with you, I have no objection. Why don’t you just ask him?” So then, my father said, “Well, what do you say? I am ready to give you the million dollars in trust, and we want you to come home and you can be Krishna conscious, but just be with us, be close to us.” So, I said, “Well, I would rather stay with Srila Prabhupada.”

So, then my mother spoke as a mother, and she was very concerned about my health. And it is true, I was quite thin and frail and I had had jaundice. But she was concerned, and in those days, people had the idea that if you don’t eat meat, you won’t get enough protein. That was the standard conception. So, she raised that point. So, Srila Prabhupada could see that both the parents, they weren’t really very happy with the way things were going. So, then he said, “I will take personal care of him. You let him remain with me,” this was in October, “You let him remain with me, I will take personal care of him. And when I come to America in April, I will bring him with me.”

So, then I said to my father, “Just see how intelligent Srila Prabhupada is, that when it is unpleasant in America, it is cold in the winter months in America, he is in India. And when it gets too hot in India and it is pleasant in America in the summer, then he goes to America.” So, I said how intelligent Srila Prabhupada was. And then, Srila Prabhupada said to my father, “Actually, your son is intelligent because he has understood my motives.” And then my father said to Srila Prabhupada, “Actually, you are very intelligent.” And then Srila Prabhupada said, “Well, I guess I must be intelligent. Otherwise, how could I attract so many intelligent, young men like your son?” So, somehow, my father’s appreciation for Srila Prabhupada was increasing, but my mother, as a mother, she began to cry. And to try to cheer her up, Srila Prabhupada gave her and everyone some sweets he had on his table. He would always keep sweets that he would distribute as prasāda, especially in Calcutta, he had rasagullā and sandeśa. So, his sister, Pishima, was putting the say sandeśa into everyone’s hands and Prabhupada was telling my mother, “Have some, have some.” And then he said, “These sweets are full of protein, this rasagullā and sandeśa, it is all cheese, it is full of protein.” [laughter] And then he said to me, “You must eat two dozen rasagullā and sandeśa every day.” [laughter] It is quite an instruction. So, he was trying to cheer them up. And in the end, it ended up on quite a sweet note. And as we were leaving, walking out of Srila Prabhupada’s room, my father said to me, “I can say two things about your master. One, he is a brilliant organizer, and two, he really knows how to deal with people.” And in my father’s value system, these were about the two highest values. So, it was a very high appreciation for Srila Prabhupada from my father.

This is a whole history, but from Calcutta, Srila Prabhupada went to Delhi for the first Delhi pandal. Gurudasa Prabhu was one of the main organizers of the first Delhi pandal. That was another adventure. And then from there, Prabhupada took a group of disciples to Vrindavan, but I went to Madras. Srila Prabhupada wanted someone to go to Madras. He had received an invitation from Dr. Bali, the husband of Vaijantimala, who was a famous Bharatnatyam dancer and later became, I guess, a film actress. And Prabhupada wanted someone to go and nobody really wanted to go, they all wanted to go with Prabhupada to Vrindavan, but I volunteered. I knew he wanted someone, and I somehow was convinced already that the secret of success in spiritual life is to please the spiritual master. So, I volunteered and I went to Madras.

And in Madras, we didn’t have a center, I was staying in different people’s homes and eating very well. That is not a big point, but it is quite incidental. [laughter] But what is significant is that we arranged a program for Srila Prabhupada. So he came; it was a very nice program on Edward Elliott’s Road, a very prestigious location in Madras, at the A.V.M. Kalyana Mandapam. And he saw that I had gained weight. So, he said I should take a picture of myself and send it to my parents, so that they will see I am hale and hearty. [laughter] So, it was just one incident that Gurudasa Prabhu reminded me of.

We have about five minutes. I think we won’t have time for questions because only five minutes, but I will stay on, maybe Gurudasa Prabhu will too, but I will stay on. So, after the ārati, if you want, you can meet with us. But you raised your hand?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:59:50]. The question I have, that is really in my heart is, when you spoke about the ātmā not changing, I understand that the truth is always truth, but the truth is always changing too. Because I can say truthfully, “It is dusk.” In the morning, it is more likely going to be dawn, it has been dawn for billions of years. So, that is the truth then, and now the truth is, “It is dusk.” So, what I am trying to say is, how do I deal with this when I don’t change, or the ātmā doesn’t change, and I am on a path for growth. [Unintelligible 01:00:55] is two simultaneously. He is unchanging, and he is also changing, he is also expanding. And I am not saying that I am anything different than anybody else, I am just saying that, how do I relate to the idea that I am unchanging as the true self, and still allowing myself the opportunity for growth, for lack of a better word, progress. Because my belief is that even my soul has to change. Otherwise, my behavior doesn’t change. And my environment doesn’t change. [Unintelligible 01:01:48]?

Giriraj Swami: I think so.

Devotee: Okay, thank you.

Giriraj Swami: Well, first of all, there is relative truth and absolute truth. Relative truths change. Okay, it is 8:30 now, and in a half hour, it will be 9:00. But absolute truths don’t change. Now, as far as you as an individual growing, as a soul, as part and parcel of Krishna, you are already perfect, but that pure soul is covered by illusion. So, for you, progress would be to become free from illusions and material attachments and, purify your consciousness so that you realize your actual eternal perfection. It is like if someone is diseased, for him, progress means to recover from the disease, to follow the doctor’s orders, to take the medicine, to follow the diet, to follow the regimen that the doctor gives. And as he makes progress, he will become more and more healthy. And then, when he is cured of the disease, he will be completely healthy, which is what he was before he got the disease. So, he is making progress, but towards a healthy condition that existed prior to the disease. So, in a sense, you could say, he is the same as he was before he made all the progress. You follow what I am saying? Or it is like you are on the land and, say you slip into the water. You get pulled out by the current, then you have to swim back to shore. So, you are making progress, as you swim, you are making progress coming closer to the shore, but when you reach the shore, you are where you began before you had your little mishap. So, we were with Krishna, somehow we came into the material world and forgot Him. So, for us progress means to revive our memory of Krishna and go back to Him. And when we are back, we are what we always were, Krishna’s eternal servant. Is that all right?

Devotee: Yes, absolutely. [laughter]

Giriraj Swami: Thank you, thank you. Yes, Puna.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:05:14]?