One Who Surrenders to Krishna Is Not the Loser but the Gainer by Millions of Times

Giriraj Swami: Now, I am seeing some new faces as well as some familiar ones, and to help everyone understand the background of tonight’s discussion I will speak about some basic principles. Now, everyone wants to be happy. Is there anyone here who doesn’t want to be happy? If you want to be happy raise your hands. Okay, so everyone wants to be happy. And if I ask you, are you always happy? How many can say that you are always happy? No one. But we want to be happy always but we are not always happy because we do not know the process for becoming perfectly and everlastingly happy. Now, that very question of happiness, are you happy? Raises another question which is, who are you? Because if we don’t know who we are we won’t know what is really in our self-interest, we don’t know what our real self is. So, most people in the present cultural climate think that they are the body and they do whatever they think will make the body happy. The body is composed of the senses and mind, so they want to do things that will give the pleasure to their senses and mind.

So, the reality is that we are not the body but we are the soul within the body, and the body is just a machine that the soul is operating. And as soon as the soul leaves the body, the body does not work anymore and we say it is dead. Actually, it is always dead, but when the soul is present we say it is alive because it is animated by the presence of the soul. And the soul within the body is like a bird within a cage, by nature the soul wants to be free but it is encaged in the body, like a bird in a cage, and even if you polish the bars of the cage very nicely and decorate the cage with nice cushions, covered with silt, nice aromatic incense, and flowers, and gems, and jewels, but if you don’t feed the bird, will the bird be happy? No. So we are like the bird in the cage and even if we have a nice house, a nice car, a good bank balance, and all the comforts and amenities for the body, but if we don’t feed the soul we won’t be happy.

And the soul is fed by association with the Supreme soul, Krishna. We independently are incomplete. In one sense, all of our endeavors are meant to make us feel complete. We feel incomplete, insufficient, so we think, If I get more money I will feel more complete, or, if I get a better house I will feel more complete, and on and on. But we never do feel complete because we can feel complete only in relation to Krishna, we are parts of Krishna and Krishna is the whole so we can feel complete only when we are reunited with the whole. And the process by which we are reunited with the whole, is generally called yoga but in particular, the most efficient and complete method is called bhakti-yoga. And through bhakti-yoga, especially chanting and hearing about Krishna, we come in touch with Krishna, and our soul’s thirst for happiness becomes quenched, and especially by chanting the Hare Krishna maha-mantra.

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare
Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare

And we should not stop, kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ, we should not stop. But even while engaged in other activities we can chant. There are no hard and fast rules so while doing housework at the same time we can chant, while riding in the car we can chant, going to school we can chant, whatever else we are doing we can chant, even when eating we can chant. It is described that the devotees of Lord Chaitanya they would chant while they were eating and if they wanted more of something they would chant the holy names to indicate that they wanted more of some preparation. So this is so easy and the only thing we have to do is do it. Sometimes we have a causeless unwillingness to do what is best for us, but it is really very easy once you begin, and you can very quickly feel the effects. So we always chant.

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare
Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare

And we feel happy. We often challenge people, people who are skeptical or reluctant, we challenge them, “Can you chant the Hare Krishna mantra and not smile?” And they can never do it, they can never do it. What do you think Radhika? Can you chant the mantra and not smile? No. Yes, it is immediate, it is natural. But the thing is that we have to sustain it. It is like when you turn on the light you can see, you can make your way around, and you can accomplish things, but if you turn off the light then you are back in the darkness. So chanting Hare Krishna turns on the light but you have to keep it on, then there is no problem.

So, Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is actually Krishna Himself. But when I say Krishna, even when I say Krishna people don’t know who is Krishna. That is also another type of ignorance. People think, first they are ordinary people, they think they are the body, that is all. And then a little more advanced, people are aware of some spiritual existence but they think that the spiritual existence is impersonal and so they think that the goal of life is for the individual soul to merge and become one with the Supreme spirit. And that is another misconception, that also leads to misery because we see that the soul is by nature active. So, because it is not the body that is active when the soul leaves the body it is dead. So it is actually the soul that is active. And so why should we think that the soul is active in conditional life but inactive in liberated life? It doesn’t make sense. Okay, it is like the bird is active in the cage, it is going here and there, wishing it had some food, so it is active, and when the bird is released from the cage it is also active but because it is free it can fly, it can enjoy.

So the soul is by nature active whether in the stage of bondage or in the liberated state. So, then what are the activities of the soul in liberation? That is where people get to have the wrong idea, they think that to become free from material bondage they have to stop activity which is impossible. And they don’t know about spiritual activity so then they think, Well, we have to engage in material activities. So spiritual activities are what we discussed, chanting, hearing, remembering Krishna, and serving Krishna in different ways. Serving Krishna, serving Krishna’s mission is a liberated activity. As we were discussing in the morning, if someone follows the laws of the land he has nothing to fear from the police or the government. But if someone breaks the laws then naturally he is going to be in anxiety. So, if we abide by the laws of God we can move about freely in the world without fear and that means that we recognize that God is the proprietor of everything, He is the enjoyer of everything, and He is ultimately the best friend of the living entities, and if we have this understanding we can be peaceful and happy.

So, now this requires a revolution in consciousness and a revolution in our activities because we are so used to working for ourselves, and everyone else is doing the same thing, but they are not happy. They are working for themselves in the false conception that they are the body, or the mind, to be happy but they are not happy. And if we imitate them we will also be the same, we will also be frustrated and disappointed. So yes, man is known by the company he keeps so we need to associate with devotees who are serving Krishna, and then gradually we can learn to serve Krishna and feel comfortable serving Krishna. So, Raghunatha dasa, the recipient of Lord Nityananda’s mercy, he was born in an extremely wealthy family. He was the only son, the only child of his parents, and his father had a brother who had no children. So the whole hosts of the family were put on Raghunatha dasa. But Raghunatha dasa, from his very childhood was spiritually inclined, like many of these children are spiritually inclined, it comes natural to them. It is actually natural, and they are happy. So sometimes the parents get worried that well if the child is too much devoted to Krishna and the practices of bhakti, what will happen to the child’s future? And that is a good question and sometimes the parents are thinking further into the future, what will happen to our family lineage? So Raghunatha dasa’s father and uncle were having the same thoughts, that Raghunatha dasa is not interested in materialistic life and if he leaves home and joins the devotees, what will happen to our estate? So, because it happened that Raghunatha dasa would try to leave home and join Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, and then his father and uncle would have to send a search party to find him and bring him back. And finally, they kept guards to make sure that he did not run away from home to join Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.

So, on one occasion Raghunatha dasa met Chaitanya Mahaprabhu personally and asked him what he should do. So, all of you spiritually inclined children should listen to what Chaitanya Mahaprabhu instructed Raghunatha dasa. He said, “You should return home, and externally you should be a very good boy, and internally you should think of Krishna and be detached from the materialistic so-called pleasures and comforts of life.” And Raghunatha dasa did that. Sometimes the example is given of the lotus flower, that the roots of the lotus are in the mud in the pond but the flower itself is not touched by the water. So, as they say, you can be in the world but not of it. And I have heard so many stories, very interesting stories of how people met devotees but they didn’t know that the person was a devotee because the devotee externally was behaving like any other person at work or at school or in whatever context. But there was something different they could see, there is something different, they didn’t know what it was but they could see that there was something different. And then when the opportunity arose, take out a book or an invitation to the temple or a mantra card and they became Krishna conscious.

So children can be a very strong influence on their parents. Of course, the parents are thinking that they want to influence their children, but the children can be a very good influence on their parents, because according to sociological studies, the main impetus for all human activity is family affection. Just today, it could be said of anyone, I am just thinking of it because it happened today, the family had come all the way from India to visit the temple and associate with devotees and attend the sādhu-saṅga retreat, but their boys wanted to see some of America and so they flew away to Las Vegas because of family affection. That is the point, that is the main factor that drives human interaction, it is family affection. So, if the children want to come to the temple and they really want to come then the parents will bring them, the children really want to go to the satsaṅga, the parents will take them and that is good. But in the parents’ minds it is only good up to a point. They want their children to be pious but not too pious to the point where they want to leave everything and join Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. But even Chaitanya Mahaprabhu advised Raghunatha, “Don’t be a crazy fellow but return home and behave like an expert businessman,” because they were in business families, “externally, and internally think of Krishna and serve Krishna.”

Now, from very early in my attempts at Krishna consciousness I was attracted by this image of Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, although I didn’t really know much about him. Even what I told you now I didn’t know because we didn’t have the Caitanya-caritāmṛta when I first joined. We did have The Teachings of Lord Chaitanya, that was a very important book for philosophy, Lord Chaitanya’s important discussions with Sarvabhauma Bhattacharya, Ramananda Raya, Rupa Gosvami, Sanatana Gosvami, but it didn’t have all the history of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and His associates. But somehow I had this image of just going to Vrindavan and wandering and chanting. And I never said anything to Srila Prabhupada, but he must have known my mind because one day in his small room in Juhu before we had the big temple, Vrinda is going like this to her mother, an example of how a child can be a good influence on a parent. But in this case, it is mutual, good influences on each other.

So I had this romantic idea of just going to Vrindavan and just wandering here and there, he rādhe. But Srila Prabhupada he had a mission, he wanted to establish Krishna consciousness in Bombay. He had a big estate, four acres in Juhu beach, very prime property. And one day he said to me that Raghunatha dasa Gosvami first managed his father’s property very expertly and then he went to Vrindavan and became a Gosvami. And he was saying in the same way, “I want you to manage the Juhu estate and then you can go to Vrindavan and become a Gosvami.” So, there are different phases in a person’s life but the common factor is Krishna consciousness. And in one sense it doesn’t matter what we do as long as we are Krishna conscious. If we are Krishna conscious we will be happy and Krishna will be happy.

So, of course, different people have different propensities, different capacities, and this is always a question. In fact, from when the children are little, well, I don’t know in every culture, but even when I was growing from a very early age people asked, “What do you want to be when you grow up?” And usually it will be something depending on what is the popular culture but don’t want to be a cowboy or a policeman. I heard that after 9/11 there were so many heroic firemen, and the children, that was number one on the list, “When I grow up I want to be a fireman.” And we actually had a very heroic fireman come to the temple, I guess it was two weekends ago.

Devotee: May 19th.

Giriraj Swami: May 19th, yes. Because usually they put on all their gear and their mask and then they all go in together with their firefighting equipment, but one of the firemen he just rushed in, he didn’t even, I think, put his mask on, his full gear, and he just rushed in to try to put out the fire as soon as possible before it could spread anymore. They are very heroic. We can also learn from them how to be heroic for Krishna, how to take risks for Krishna. So, cowboy, policeman, fireman, pilot, I don’t know what is current now, but I had this idea after coming to Krishna consciousness to be like Raghunatha dasa Gosvami. And Srila Prabhupada said, “First you manage your father’s estate expertly and then you go to Vrindavan to become a Gosvami.” And it was very intense.

I remember on one occasion I went to the airport to receive Srila Prabhupada and we were driving in the car to Juhu, and just in the drive from the front gate to the back of the property where Srila Prabhupada was living in one of the old apartment buildings, he was just pointing out things left and right that were wrong, “What is this? What is that?” I remember some of the things, not all, but say if a light was left on, “What is that? Why is that light on?” And my head was reeling. And then we had a lot of palm trees, coconut trees, and we would hire people, they would come, they are quite skillful, they climb up and they have their. . . And so one of the men was carrying away some of the palm leaves, dry palm leaves. He said, “What is that? You cannot be allowed to take the leaves.” It was literally so many things, so quickly, and I was so young, my head was reeling.

So, it was not easy, and it may be true in general that unless one submits oneself to some severe discipline one cannot really improve. At the sādhu-saṅga retreat, not only there before and after, but I had some talks with Madhava, great kirtan leader, he met Aindra Prabhu, who was the head of the twenty-four-hour kirtan in Vrindavan, when he was about eighteen years old, and he had a natural ability to play mridanga. Did you play mridanga this morning? I thought so.

So, he had a natural ability to play mridanga and he was very good, but he wouldn’t chant while he was playing mridanga. Were you chanting while you were playing mridanga? Madhava wasn’t chanting and every evening Aindra would call him into his room and smash him for not singing. And the reason he gave was that it is a natural tendency for the mridanga player to race ahead and play faster than the lead singer. So Aindra Prabhu said that, “If you sing then you have to be in the same temple as the lead singer, and you won’t be able to race ahead on the mridanga. But if you don’t sing and you are just absorbed in playing the mridanga, then just get into it more and more and more and pretty soon you are going faster than the lead singer and that disturbs the mood of the kirtan. So, as he described it, it was very heavy. Of course, if you are doing something relatively simple then it is relatively easier to chant while you are doing it. But if you are doing intricate drum beats the tendency might be just to concentrate on playing the instrument and not singing. But Aindra Prabhu wouldn’t allow it.

And I have heard other stories of how Aindra Prabhu would really. . . One boy told me the very first time he joined the twenty-four-hour kirtan, Aindra Prabhu just smashed and he said, “Who is he? Who does he think he is? He is just come for the first time.” But those who submitted to that training they really benefited. So that is part of it. Of course, it is chanting and dancing, it is all chanting and dancing, it is blissful, but on occasion if one wants to come to a higher level he has to submit himself to some discipline and that helps us to grow and it also makes us realize we are not the body. That our behavioral patterns and thought patterns are not us; they can be changed. Who we really are, we are eternal servants of Krishna, and when we act as eternal servants of Krishna we are happy. And Raghunatha dasa, in the end, he got his desire to serve Chaitanya Mahaprabhu fulfilled. And so he is an example of someone who is exemplary in household life and then he was exemplary in renounced life. He set both examples. And in our movement, there are many examples of people who gave up what could have been very spectacular careers in the material world for the sake of Krishna consciousness, and one is Yamuna devi, Srila Prabhupada’s disciple Yamuna devi. If you know who Yamuna devi is raise your hand. Are you sure you know? Okay, who?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:42:50].

Giriraj Swami: It is a famous devotee who is a good kirtan leader and a good preacher, that is true. You are absolutely correct. And can anyone supply any more details? Vrinda.

Devotee: She [Unintelligible 00:43:21].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, she sings the Govinda prayers that we play at the time of deity greeting in every temple in ISKCON all over the world. And does anyone know who produced the record with the Govinda prayers? Radhika. Oh, I thought you raised your hand, okay. Who is saying? Are you speculating or do you know?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:44:05].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, George Harrison, the Beatles. It was produced on Apple Records, and George Harrison plays on the record. And one of the tracks on the album is Bhaja hūre mana śrī-nanda-nandana. That was not recorded for the album, Yamuna devi was just singing that on her own and George recorded it without her even knowing that he was recording it and then he dubbed some basic instrumentation and that is one of the tracks. She had so much devotion and such a beautiful voice. So, George told her that, “If you like, I can make you the most famous female vocalist in the world or one of them, you can be at the top.” But she declined; she was not interested in that, she wanted to serve Srila Prabhupada and Krishna, and she sang for Krishna. And she was not the loser. This is also a very important point, that one who gives to Krishna, one who surrenders to Krishna is not the loser but is the gainer by many times.

Once when I was first coming to the Boston temple, a man in the audience asked Srila Prabhupada if he was happy and Srila Prabhupada replied, “When I was in India I had five children and there were always so many problems.” Of course, you all are like angels, I am sure there are no problems for your parents. But Srila Prabhupada said, “Before I came to Krishna I had five children and there were always so many problems, and now after surrendering to Krishna I have five hundred children and I love them and they love me and there are no problems.” And then the man said, “Yes, but that is material.” And Srila Prabhupada said that, “I have many other platforms of happiness but I am giving this example to you because this is something that you can relate to.” So, this is a very important point, that one who surrenders to Krishna is not the loser but he is the gainer by many times. And one of my favorite stories in the Kṛṣṇa book also illustrates that point. Who knows what is the Kṛṣṇa book? Yes.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 00:48:25].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, it tells all of Krishna’s pastimes. And what is it based on? Where did those pastimes come from originally?

Devotee: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Giriraj Swami: Yes, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Kṛṣṇa book is a summary study of the Tenth Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. So, in those days there was a system of barter. Do you know what is barter?

Devotee: Exchange of goods.

Giriraj Swami: Yes, exchange of goods. So, one day a lady who was selling fruits came to the house of Nanda and Yasoda with her fruits, and she wanted to sell her fruits but the medium of exchange was not money but it was other goods. And Krishna saw the lady and He was very small, I think maybe three years old, younger than you are, but He had seen how His parents would exchange goods. So, He went into the pantry and He filled His hands with rice and He was going to give her rice in exchange for the fruit. But because His hands were so small and He wasn’t very expert in keeping them tight, so by the time He reached the lady with the basket of fruit almost all the grains of rice had fallen out of His hands. But still, that lady was so captivated by little Krishna’s beauty that she didn’t mind. She just wanted to make this boy happy, so she gave Him all the fruits and she was just happy that He was happy. And then she saw that in her basket where all the fruit had been it was filled with jewels, and gems, and gold, and precious metals. So that is what happened, she gave her fruits to Krishna in love, spontaneous love, not to get something in return, but in return, she got a basket full of priceless treasures; gems, and jewels. So that is the lesson, that one who gives to Krishna is not the loser but the gainer by many times.

Now, sometimes it happens in the life of a devotee that there may be a reversal, otherwise someone might think, Well, this is a good business, I give Krishna fruit and I get jewels in exchange, this is a good business. And then people would come to Krishna not in the mood of pure devotion but in a business mood. So Krishna, He does reward His devotees but He may not do it immediately. And that is also a test, “Is my devotee serious about serving Me or does My devotee want some material gain?” And then if the material gain is not there then the person will go somewhere else. That is a test of Krishna. But ultimately, if one passes the test then Krishna will give one things much more valuable than one could ever imagine, and ultimately, He gives Himself, that is the goal, that is the greatest treasure, prema-dāna, treasure of pure love.

But again, this business mentality is there, it happens in India, but it probably happens here. I have seen the sign at Radha-Kalachandji dhāma, the list of sponsorship, and received the blessings of the oldest deities, worshiped in the western world. So people see that, receive the blessings, what does that mean? Often people have the idea that the blessing will be the fulfillment of some material desire, and it happens. Especially with one deity in India, Balaji at Tirupati. It is known to be very generous and fulfilling desires, and so people go there. The politicians go there, they want to get blessings for the election. Even the prime minister of Mauritius went to Tirupati to get blessings for the elections there.

And sometimes they make a vow. If I get such and such, then I will give such and such. It is like a deal; they don’t know who they are dealing with but it is like a deal, if I get such and such I will give you such and such. There is one joke, this is a very good joke, but I heard a joke in India that a worshiper went to the deity, he was going to the racetrack to bet on the horses. So he went to the deity and he said, “Lord, if I win a hundred thousand rupees I will give you fifty thousand.” So okay, he went, he bet on his horse, but his horse didn’t come in first but he came in second and he won fifty thousand rupees. So he went to the deity and he said, “Lord, you didn’t trust me, you took your half first.” The fact is that the more we give to Krishna the more we get, but the ultimate benefit is to get pure devotion for Krishna and then we get Krishna.

It is said that the impersonalists, they want to become one with God but the devotees they can become greater than God. Not that they actually become greater but God comes under the control of their pure love. In Calcutta our landlord was a Bengali man and he had his own theories of spiritual life and he met one of our devotees named Achyutananda, and they were having some talk, and Mr. Singhroy said that Chaitanya Mahaprabhu was actually the origin of Radha and Krishna. We had understood that Chaitanya Mahaprabhu was the combined form of Radha and Krishna, but he was saying that Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is the origin of Radha and Krishna. And that He is greater than Radha and Krishna. And he gave the example of milk and sugar, that rasagullā is greater than milk and sugar separately.

So, Achyutananda asked to Srila Prabhupada in a room full of devotees, and he said, “So, who comes first? Is it Radha and Krishna or is it Chaitanya Mahaprabhu?” And Srila Prabhupada said that it is Radha and Krishna, it is the same example that first the milk and sugar exist and then they combine and become rasagullā. And then Achyutananda asked, “And who is greater?” Srila Prabhupada paused and then he opened his eyes and he said, “Radharani, Radharani is the greatest.” And then he pointed to a print on the wall that showed Radharani sitting on a higher level and Krishna kneeling at Her feet and begging for Her favor. And then he said, “Nanda Maharaja is the greatest.” And he pointed to another picture that showed little Krishna carrying Nanda Maharaja’s sandals on His head, he said, “Nanda Maharaja is the greatest.” And then he said that the devotee is the greatest, Krishna comes under the control of His devotee, He likes to serve His devotee.

Sometimes people misunderstand. For example, when Lord Ramachandra was traveling south in India in search of Sita, He came to Rameswaram and He worshipped Lord Shiva there. So, people wrongly cite this incident as proof that Lord Shiva is greater than Lord Rama but that, of course, is not the case. But the explanation is that Krishna likes to serve His devotees, He likes to worship His devotees. Do you know the story of Sudama Brahman? Does anyone know the story of Sudama Brahman? Let us hear you, you think you can tell it?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:02:37].

Giriraj Swami: Wait, this is quite an elaborate telling of the story, but why don’t we pause here? And you can think about the rest of it because there are two instructions in the story that I want to bring out so I will bring out one now. So, you just said it a minute ago, Krishna brought him into his palace and washed his feet so this shows that Krishna, of course, He was showing respect to a brahman, but really shows that Krishna likes to worship His devotees. So, Krishna worshiped Sudama, doesn’t mean Sudama is supreme. So in the same way, Lord Rama worshiped Shiva at Rameswaram, it doesn’t mean that Shiva is supreme. But Krishna likes to worship His devotees. Arjuna commanded Krishna, “Drive my chariot between the two armies.” Krishna was obeying the orders of Arjuna but doesn’t mean that Arjuna is supreme, but Krishna likes to serve His devotees.

So, are you ready with the end of the story?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:07:57], “Why are you here?” And then he was like, “Oh, I just really miss you so I wanted to come to meet you, [Unintelligible 01:08:05].”

Giriraj Swami: Where are you getting all of this by the way?

Devotee: Different sources.

Giriraj Swami: DVD?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:08:27].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, it is mixed. All right, well, you have told it very well with a lot of feeling and a lot of detail, and there are some differences between what you said and what is in the Bhāgavatam, and when people make these DVDs they don’t always follow exactly, they have their own conceptions of what will be appealing to the audience or they have their own ideas. So, maybe I will just finish it. So, Sudama didn’t ask for anything. He did not ask for anything, and Krishna didn’t offer him anything. But Sudama was just happy because he had met his friend Krishna, and they had their loving exchange. So when Sudama was walking home he was in bliss thinking of his association with Krishna. But then he eventually thought of his wife and well, “I am coming empty-handed, not bringing anything.” But when he got to where his simple home was he found that in its place there was a big palace and beautiful gardens and servants. He had given Krishna just a morsel of broken rice, not because Krishna likes poha, but because that was all they could borrow from the neighbors.

But Sudama was very afraid of that opulence. He was afraid that he would forget Krishna, and he was more concerned about remembering Krishna than living in opulence. And he thought, If living in opulence is going to divert my attention from Krishna then I don’t want this opulence. But then Krishna assured him that, “No, you will not forget Me, you can live in this opulence in a detached way and you will not forget Me, and in the end, you will come to Me.” So this is the real essence that a devotee doesn’t really mind whether he lives in opulence or poverty externally. What he wants is to be in loving relationship with Krishna, that is his happiness. And if Krishna wants him to live in a palace and in the mood of service to Krishna he can live in a palace, if Krishna wants him to live in a shack, as long as he has Krishna consciousness he is happy wherever he is. In fact, there is another story. Since we somehow got under the subject of Lord Shiva. So Lord Shiva, he is like the most powerful of the demigods and his wife, who knows who is the wife of Lord Shiva?

Devotee: Parvati.

Giriraj Swami: Parvati. And who can say a few words about who is Parvati other than the wife of Lord Shiva? Yes, [Unintelligible 01:13:01].

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:13:03].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, she is the manifestation of the material energy, Durga. Yes, she is. So, she is also very powerful. And do you know where they live?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:13:26].

Giriraj Swami: And what kind of a house do they live in?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:13:33].

Giriraj Swami: Well, so no one knows what kind of a house they live in. Good, you are honest, they don’t live in a house, they live under a tree. But people were telling them, “You are Lord Shiva Mahadeva and your wife is Parvati Durga and you are living under a tree? You should live in a house.” Here also we have that social pressure. So finally hearing it from so many people for so long, Shiva gave in, “Okay, so we will make a house.” Because he is not an ordinary man he made a house made of solid gold and then they had the housewarming griha pravesh. One sage came with a thousand disciples, large number of disciples, and so Parvati prepared prasāda and she fed all the disciples, and she used up all the provisions in her kitchen to feed all the guests. So at the end, the rishi said, “Now, what about my dakṣiṇā, I have come to your home, you have to give dakṣiṇā.”

So they said, “Well, we don’t really have anything to give you, we used to live under a tree, now we are living in in a house but all we had was the cooking ingredients and we have already used up all the cooking ingredients to feed you all so we don’t have anything.” He said, “Well, that is your problem, but I have come to your house and you have to give dakṣiṇā.” “Well, but we don’t have anything, we can’t, we don’t have anything to give you.” “You have to give dakṣiṇā.” So then Shiva and Parvati consulted what to do and they gave him the house that was all they had so they gave him the house, gold house, and they were back living under the trees.

So again, there is so many instructions. One is that we get what we are destined to have, we can’t artificially increase it or even decrease it. And yes, they were happy. So that is the real wealth of a devotee, is Krishna consciousness, and that wealth can be achieved most easily in the present age of Kali by chanting the holy names.

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare
Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare

So, is the microphone connected? All right, well, I wanted to conclude with one more story about Sanatana Gosvami and the touchstone. Who knows the story of Sanatana Gosvami and the touchstone? Do you want to take a chance?

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:18:34].

Giriraj Swami: Okay. So, again, Lord Shiva. So, there was a worshiper of Lord Shiva and Lord Shiva wanted to give him a boon, so he said, “I want the most valuable thing.” Now, he thought the most valuable thing is touchstone, that whatever you touch with the touchstone it becomes like gold. And so he said, “Yes, you can see Sanatana Gosvami, he is living near the Yamuna river in Vrindavan and he can give you the most valuable thing.” So, he went to him and he said, “I want the most valuable thing.” “What do you mean, the touchstone? Oh, it is out in the back in the trash.” So he went, picked through the trash and he found it, so he touched some things that all turned to gold, he thought, Wow, I am going to be the richest man in the world.

But then he thought, “If Sanatana Gosvami is keeping this in the trash he must not consider it very important, he must have something more valuable than the touchstone. Maybe I should go back and ask for that.” So he went back and Sanatana Gosvami said, “Oh, you want that thing? Oh, really the most valuable thing. All right, well, then you have to throw the touchstone in the river.” So he hesitated because he knew the value of the touchstone, it could turn things to gold. But still, he could figure that Sanatana Gosvami definitely had something more valuable but he wasn’t sure what it was. So he calculated and he decided to take the chance. So he threw the touchstone in the river and he came back and he said, “Okay, now I want really the most valuable thing.” And Sanatana Gosvami said, “Okay, sit down and I will give it to you.”

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare
Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare

So that is truly the most valuable, hari-nāma cintāmaṇi, it is also a cintāmaṇi gem, hari-nāma but spiritual. It can give everything, no consideration material or spiritual, can give everything; whatever the devotee wants or whatever is best for the devotee. And anyone can chant, anyone can dance, can be young, old, boy, girl, it is universal. And not only is it universal, you can do it all together. iPhones are pretty universal but you don’t do it together. They are together, they are in the car, they are in the park, but each one separately. But chanting is universal, everyone can do it, and you can do it together so it is a very nice group activity, the best.

So this is the great gift of Krishna consciousness. It is this gift that makes people ready to give up anything and everything like Raghunatha dasa Gosvami and even some of our contemporaries in a way like Yamuna devi. And yes, fully satisfied. Fully satisfied means they don’t want anything other than Krishna consciousness, Krishna’s name, and Krishna’s service. They want more, they want to do more service, they want to chant more, but they are satisfied in the sense they don’t want anything outside of Krishna. So, let us just speak more tomorrow. So are there any questions or comments? Yes.

Devotee: [Unintelligible 01:25:07].

Giriraj Swami: Yes, well, I will speak more about the Panihati festival tomorrow morning so if you come to the temple at seven or seven thirty or two again we will do it because it is not something that you can tell in five minutes, it takes more than that. Deva Darshan.

Devotee: Hare Krishna Maharaja. During the sādhu-saṅga retreat the kirtan leaders were saying, “Sing from the heart and deeper from the heart.” Without making into a confession session, I couldn’t do it. Can you please tell us how to chant from the heart? What one feels when one chants from the heart?

Giriraj Swami: Well, there is a process and I did mention that on the way to the retreat Madhava Prabhu’s wife Radika Mataji, mentioned that she had heard that a disciple had asked Srila Prabhupada what should be his mood when he chants. And Srila Prabhupada said, “You should feel the presence of Krishna, but if you can’t feel Krishna’s presence then you should listen attentively to every name.” So, that is the basic, that you just try to fix your mind on the sound of the name and when you do that Krishna reciprocates. You can feel He is reciprocating, or in other words, you feel His presence. And then when you feel His presence and you call His names, it is more personal. You know Krishna is there, Radharani is there, and they are hearing you call Their names, and They respond. And whatever your desire is because you are calling Their name and then They are responding, “Yes, you called My name, what do you want?” Then whatever you want you can say.

So, it may be to chant with attention, to have more taste while chanting, or whatever it is, to be able to get up earlier in the morning so you can chant earlier in the day, or whatever would be favorable. You won’t ask for anything material, that would spoil it but something related to service. And depending on what it is that can also come immediately. Say you could pray to take me out of the body concept and Krishna will respond immediately. Something will happen, “Oh, I used to respond like that, now I am responding differently, this must be Krishna’s response to my chanting.”

Another thing, Madhava Prabhu quoted Aindra as saying, “When you chant you should cry for Krishna and if you can’t cry for Krishna you should cry because you can’t cry.” But the whole thing is to really get into it, really put yourself fully into it, otherwise, it is just words and it is just mental. But if you really put yourself into it wholeheartedly, just setting everything aside and really putting yourself fully into it, Krishna reciprocates. You can feel Krishna’s presence and then from the heart you are calling His names, Radharani’s names. But chanting louder. Once I asked Srila Prabhupada something about maya and he said, “Chant loudly.” Letting go all inhibitions and shame and just giving yourself to it.

But sometimes the organizers of festivals, in a way they can’t absorb themselves as fully as the visitors because they have to think about the organization, that is their service. The first time I invited His Holiness Indradyumna Swami to South Africa, I was the GBC and he had just come from the Amazon and it was like “Wow!” That was so exotic, and so exciting, and so amazing, and I said, “Wow, I feel like I am just staying back here and just doing all these nitty-gritty things.” And Maharaja said, “Well, what you are doing is very important. What you are doing is allowing people like me to come in and lead kirtan and tell stories and show slides.” So it may be that you were maybe a little preoccupied with the organization, I don’t know, you might have been tired from making so many arrangements. And that was like a facility to us, we didn’t have to worry about anything because of all of you, and then when the time comes someone else will be making the arrangements and you can just come, forget about everything and just absorb yourself. I don’t think you should be too hard on yourself.

Davi Darshan Prabhu, ki jaya!

Any other questions or comments? Yes.

Devotee: Maharaja Giriraj, we see even matter has a tendency to act as for their nature. Even most of the animals they act according to their nature. But we as human beings if our nature is [Unintelligible 01:34:17] if our nature is to have a mood of servitude, then why do we have [Unintelligible 01:34:07] tendency. Why do we have the mood of being master of going against our mutual quality?

Giriraj Swami: Yes, what my godbrother, Ravrinda Svarupa Prabhu says is that we as living entities, as spirit souls, we have made a decision to surrender to Krishna, to be a devotee of Krishna, to come to our original position. But our minds are slow. We have decided but our mind hasn’t kept up with our decisions, and our mind is in the old mood of enjoying, wanting to enjoy, and control, and possess. So it takes time to retrain the mind, and the mind is used to working on behalf of the false ego. So now, jīvera ‘svarūpa’ haya — kṛṣṇera ‘nitya-dāsa’, that is our real ego, that is our real identity, we are the eternal servant of Krishna, but the mind has been used to working for the false ego, the false conception that I am the body, everything related to the body is mine, and I am the enjoyer, I am the controller, I am the proprietor. So we have decided but the mind is slow. The mind is acting the other way on the basis of false ego. So it is a struggle. But yes, kirtan helps, japa helps, associating with devotees, advanced devotees, worshiping the deity, immersing oneself in the holy dhāmas, all these things help to infuse the mind with spiritual impressions.

Yes, Ravi.

Devotee: When it comes to either enjoying or serving Krishna, what is the balance between quoting Krishna because we enjoy Him and His name versus approaching Him in order to serve Him?

Giriraj Swami: “Well, the two are not really different. One disciple Gurudasa, he is one of the early disciples, he told Srila Prabhupada that he liked playing the kartals and he thought it was sense gratification, and Srila Prabhupada said, “There is two kinds of sense gratification: material and spiritual. So playing the kartals in kirtan is spiritual.” So if one is fortunate enough to relish the holy name, to relish devotional service in any way, to appreciate the beauty of the deities, to appreciate the taste of prasāda, that is good. But we shouldn’t indulge ourselves even in spiritual sense gratification at the cost of Krishna’s service. And it is described that Krishna had a servant named Daruka, he was also the driver. And once Daruka was fanning Krishna and he was so overwhelmed with ecstatic love that tears were coming from his eyes and he was trembling. But he condemned his ecstatic symptoms because they were interfering with his service of fanning Krishna. So, it is good if you relish the kirtan, but it shouldn’t be that, there is a fire in the kitchen, we need you to come and help. “No, no I am relishing, don’t disturb me.” No, it is good if you are relishing, but the highest consideration is Krishna’s service and Krishna’s pleasure, and even if we have to sacrifice our own spiritual enjoyment or even ecstasy, if it is a matter of Krishna service then we set it aside for Krishna.

So, I think we have had a very good discussion and we can proceed to the next item on the program. I am not sure what the next item is.

All right, I think that is a good proposal. How many are in favor of having prasādam now?