Experiences and Realizations—50 Years of ISKCON

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna. So, we are all sitting in this beautiful temple in the association of wonderful devotees because of Srila Prabhupada and ISKCON. Nityananda Prabhu has asked us to speak about ISKCON. So, I thought just to speak about some events to which I was personally a party, which mark some milestones in the development of ISKCON. They took place in Boston in 1969.

At the time, we were living in a storefront at 95 Glenville Avenue, and the lease was about to expire, and Satsvarupa Maharaja was the temple president. We all felt that we should try to get a bigger place and a better place, but the devotees couldn’t find anything in time. So, we had to renew the lease on Friday, but something within me kept saying we shouldn’t do this, we have to get a better place.

So, I told Satsvarupa Maharaja that the landlord won’t know until midnight whether we were going to leave or not, and then he won’t be able to do anything before Monday, so we have the weekend, so let’s just try. So, we actually found a place, a big mansion that had something to do with dead people. So, we got it, and that was the first immovable property that ISKCON owned.

So then, we had our plans. As Srila Prabhupada said, “You have your plans, I have my plans, and Krishna has His plans.” So, we, local Boston devotees, had our plans on how we were going to use all this space. And then, Srila Prabhupada said that he wanted to move the press to Boston. It wasn’t a physical press, but it was a press operation. But we did end up getting everything to produce books, and Srila Prabhupada was so pleased.

Satsvarupa Maharaja had a printing press, and he was so pleased that he had his own press in his own building. And from that press, we produced many books. Srila Prabhupada was bringing out one Chapter of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam at a time. Of course, he had done the first three volumes, which were the first Canto, and then one after the other, he would give titles for those one Chapter books, and then we produced The Nectar of Devotion and different books. And Srila Prabhupada came, and he was very pleased.

So, at the time, it was called ISKCON Press and the BBT hadn’t been established, but it was really Prabhupada’s heart. And yes, it was so memorable when he came to Boston because the devotees gave him a tour of the press and he was so happy.

Now, to get that building, it was very expensive for us, and so we had a mortgage. And the way it worked was that we had to pay, and if we didn’t meet our payments, the owner, the mortgage was with him, the owner could repossess the place and we would lose all the money that we put in.

So, in the press, there were so many departments; of course, a typing department and the devotees had a typewriter, a fancy typewriter, an electric typewriter. It was a composing machine and it was expensive and we had only one. And so, the devotees who were doing the composing, they had shifts of twenty-four hours a day, that composing machine was being used. And there was the Sanskrit department, the art department that was in the preparation, and then there was the printing and the photo lab, and the book binding—all the different departments from beginning to end.

So, we were making payments. Srila Prabhupada wanted us to distribute BTGs at that time and he placed a huge order for BTGs, and then he had every temple accept a quota. We knew that our selling the BTGs was related to our making the mortgage payments. So, it went on all right for the first few months, but then in the winter, it was so cold in Boston, it was hard to get devotees to go out, and it was hard to stop people on the street, and it was just obvious that we weren’t going to be able to make the payment, and we were all in anxiety what’s going to happen.

So, one Sunday, literally just a day or two before the end of the month, would be at the beginning of the next month when we had to make the payment, a sort of elderly lady came to the Sunday feast, which was unusual because most of our crowd was in their late teens or early twenties. And suddenly, she came up and she said, “These paintings you have on the walls are very nice, I would like to buy some, but is it possible.” But I said, “Yes, it is, which ones would you want?”

So, she selected a number of the paintings that Iris had done and she said, “How much do I pay for these?” So, I guess most of them. Satsvarupa Maharaja, he knew how much we needed for the mortgage, and so he named that figure and added a little to it, and she was happy. And she paid and we were able to make the mortgage payment, and everything went on. I think back and forth, you can say something.

Devotee: I can’t say that I participated in any milestones, or even yard stones, but I guess most of my experience was in Latin America. And so, of course, some pioneering devotees have come before me. Before I joined in 1969, I won’t even mention what I was doing. Actually, I was studying part time. But by Krishna’s arrangement, I met the devotees when I was studying in 1971, but I didn’t take it very seriously and they disappeared from my vision. And finally, I was drafted into the army.

I started chanting there, just out of looking for relief from affliction and misery. But somehow, I ended up in Latin America. And I just remember the experience I had, when I first wrote to the devotees, and one devotee who was answering letters, Svarupa Prabhu, he wrote me back. And I said, “So, what can I do? I’m here in Panama, there is no devotee, no temple, there is nothing.” And he said, “I’ll put you in touch with a brahmachari, he’ll tell you what to do.”

So, he said, “Why don’t you do saṅkīrtana?” I said, “What’s that?” This is all letters, so it takes two weeks to get the answer back. And he said, “It means distributing books.” So, I said, “Okay, if you could send me some books, I’ll do my best.” So, he did, he sent me about twenty boxes of books, and I was trying to figure out how to distribute them. At that time, I didn’t speak any Spanish, and they were all books in English.

So, I started distributing it to the people on the military bases, and then by Krishna’s arrangement, the person in charge of where I was staying said, “You don’t belong here.” Because I was getting up at three in the morning, everyone would throw beer cans and shoes and anything they could, “Turn off that light.” They were all complaining about me. I thought he was going to send me to the peeling potatoes kitchen. He said, “Actually, I think you should be with the Chaplain’s department, you are into religious things.” And he said, “And you shouldn’t live in barracks, so I’m going to authorize you separate rations and separate housing.” So, I was able to rent a farm, and that was a nice arrangement.

So, I had a lot of Bhagavad-gītās, and the little books were easier for me to distribute to the soldiers, but the bigger books were a little more difficult. They didn’t get paid very much, and I got paid much more than them, more than the average person. So, since I was in the chaplain’s office, everybody that would come in for counseling, I would say, “The Chaplain will help you out, but this book will really explain and solve all the problems in your life.”

And so, I would give up some Bhagavad-gītā. But I made the mistake of doing that before they went in, and they were all walking in with the Bhagavad-gītā to see the Chaplain. So, he said, “You can’t do this.” I said, “What, if you tell me I can’t do it, wouldn’t that be religious discrimination?” He said, “Well, at least do it when they come out.” So, I said, “Okay.” That way, I was able to distribute all the Bhagavad-gītā. So, that was my introduction to Krishna consciousness.

And then, when I got out of the army, while I was processing out, I still had about three or four boxes of books. I decided to do saṅkīrtana on the street corner. Actually, I didn’t know the devotees actually did that, but it just seemed like something I should do. And I saw somebody on the other corner. He was distributing books and he was looking at me also. He was nice, so I walked across the street and I looked at his book. He said, “Oh, Hare Krishna.” It was Narottama Prabhu. So, he took me back to the library party, so I met Satsvarupa Maharaja, Mahabhuri Prabhu, Bhakti Tirtha Maharaja, Ghanshyama, at that time. 

And then I got attached to a library party, but I was supposed to be part of the Costa Rica temple, which had just opened, and I had to collect a ticket for my temple president and myself to go to India. So, we got to India and he complained to Prabhupada. He said, “Satsvarupa Maharaja is taking one of my men.” We were talking about this last night because there was a lot of possessiveness at that time, you belong to just a place.

So, I was just sitting on the periphery and Prabhupada said, “So then, you should go back to Costa Rica library party with sannyasis,” and now I go back to Costa Rica, so that’s how I ended up in Latin America. And I guess most of my devotional career was, at least at that time, pioneering. That was the spirit of Srila Prabhupada at that time. As soon as you do something, then he would send you out. The mood was as soon as you learn something, you go out, you start something. And especially in Latin America, this wide-open field, and so I guess that was a change in one area of the world that I participated in to some degree, and it was just a very wonderful experience.

I especially think nowadays, we need a little more of that, maybe in a different way because I’ve been thinking about this a lot. Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu’s instructions to Kurma brahman, and now people are more of a congregational based society. But Mahaprabhu’s instruction to Kurma brahman was, “Your house should become a temple.”

āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra’ ei deśa

yāre dekha, tāre kaha ‘kṛṣṇa’-upadeśa

“Whoever you meet, wherever you go, whatever you know about Krishna, just teach that.” So, it seems like in the present context of ISKCON, this is the way that all of us can do this pioneering work, which was Srila Prabhupada’s. Certainly, he was always wanting to open up the next place, the next place. I heard, I didn’t experience it, but I heard from some of the senior devotees that I worked with, where Prabhupada would go, he would ask for a map and see and talk to the devotees how to expand.

So, when I heard that, I was also everywhere. I went, I got a map, mapped out the city, mapped out the country. And we had to put it into sections, this is how we should conquer it. We weren’t quite able to conquer at the speed that I thought, but anyway, I wanted to share that pioneering spirit. Srila Prabhupada - who could pioneer more than him? Crossing the ocean against everyone’s advice, and he kept that pioneering spirit, expanding Krishna consciousness out of compassion, feeling, and love for all the living entities who are bewildered in this material world.

So, it’s very important that we maintain this spirit. Just like Bhakti Bringa Govinda Maharaja was speaking yesterday from Bṛhad-Bhāgavatāmṛta, that this pioneering spirit comes from Mahaprabhu and was transferred to the Six Gosvamis and Sanatana Gosvami included them, infused the Bṛhad-bhāgavatāmṛta with the need for the saṅkīrtana to be spread. And so, from my experience, it’s one of the most rewarding experiences in life, when you can.

I remember one time, one devotee came up to me and he said, “Ten years ago, I met you on the street and you gave me a book, and from that book, I found a temple and I came,” It’s such a such a reward. It’s such a rewarding experience to feel that sometimes when you distribute books, or even any service, sometimes we can feel a little overburdened because there is so much to do for Krishna. But when you get that reciprocation from the Deity, from someone you preached to, then it makes everything feel like this is it, it was all worth it, that I could participate in this way in Krishna consciousness, serve the Deity, and indeed instill some feeling in my heart or that some person says, “Thank you very much for giving me Krishna consciousness, a book, prasādam, the holy name.”

So, anyway, just sharing that was how I could put my little grain of sand into this movement by trying to pioneer, and I’m still trying to do that to some degree when Krishna gives me the chance. So, some experiences that I have had.

Hare Krishna.

The next important phase that I was first involved with was bringing ISKCON to India, but Srila Prabhupada’s spiritual master had instructed him to bring Krishna consciousness to the western world in particular. And the devotees asked Srila Prabhupada about going to India now, and he said, “I already did that, what my Guru Maharaja instructed, and now I want to go back to India.”

So, the idea was that each temple, and there were maybe fourteen temples then, each temple would send basically the number two person, the best person that could be spared. And so, I was chosen from Boston. I was the saṅkīrtana leader, temple commander, and treasurer. And before leaving, I just had this impression, I don’t know where it came from, that Lord Jagannatha was sending me to India. And as I was at the front door ready to leave and go to the airport, Pujari Rukmini devi dasi came up to me and she said, “I got the feeling that Lord Jagannatha was sending you to India.”

So, we went, we stopped in Belgium. Gurudasa Prabhu knew a man who was connected with an airline called Basco Airlines, Brothers Air Services Company. And they had, I won’t even describe, I can’t describe the type of aircraft they had, it was some old reject from World War II and it was wild. And so, we met in Brussels, and that was the first time I met these celebrated figures in ISKCON—Gurudasa, Yamuna, and Shyamasundara, Malati, and they are so Krishna conscious.

And then, other devotees joined and we stopped in Cairo on the way. And there were adventures there, and then we came to Bombay. Although there was a bit of strangeness, a lot of busyness, a lot of people. I mean, sometimes people come from India to visit me and I have taken them down to downtown Santa Barbara, and they say, “Where are all the people?”

So, this is the reverse, there are so many people, and then the cows on the street. I liked it, but it was different. But very soon, I felt at home, I felt like this is really my home. And Srila Prabhupada took us to a temple in the very old section of Bombay called Shapur Bagh, Lakshmi-Narayana temple, and they had these big fans. They were pieces of cloth put on a frame and then there was a rope and then someone would stand outside the Deity room pulling on the rope, and it would fan the Deities. And it was so opulent and it reminded me of The Nectar of Devotion where Srila Prabhupada wrote that the Deity is worshiped like a king. It’s very regal and everything came to life, all the things we had read about were just coming to life, and the temple had a goshala connected to it and we saw the cows.

And the people in India, most of them, the pious ones, were so moved and they saw us doing hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana, literally, they would weep with joy because for so many centuries, foreign powers have come and denigrated them and exploited them. We were Americans, the top of the world, accepting their culture.

So, I remember one day, we did hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana from the government building, a huge building, multi-story, very long, and we were seeing all the faces of the government people in the windows, and we were just chanting as usual, and eventually, one of the officers from inside came out and said, “The whole government machinery has come to a standstill, could you please move on?” So, yes, it was quite amazing.

And there was a magazine comparable to Life magazine in America when Life magazine was very popular, and we had a color photo of the devotees’ hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana right in the center of Bombay on the cover, and it was a full spread, and it really took the about storm, you could say, as one of our life members said.

And so, we were traveling but Srila Prabhupada wanted to establish permanent centers, and especially wanted a place in Vrindavan where his foreign disciples could come. And within a very short period, one after the other, he got land in Mayapur and in Vrindavan and Bombay.

So, one major program was to have a pandal program. Probably many of you know by now, but a pandal is an open-air tent. It’s made of, in the location, bamboo poles, and then it would be covered with cloth, and it was modular. I mean, you could just keep adding sections to it, it could be any size. And then usually, there would be a stage, and then behind the stage, you would have rooms where Prabhupada could sit and meet people, and so on.

So, our advisor said that this is how the big swamis have their programs. So, we presented the idea to Srila Prabhupada, and he said we should try for it, and he said it’s like shooting a rhinoceros, that everyone knows you can’t get a rhinoceros. So, if you fail, nobody will blame you, but if you succeed, everyone will praise you.

So, we did it, and there were probably twenty thousand people a day coming, and then on the weekend, thirty thousand, and from the pandal programs, many devotees joined. One, he didn’t join immediately, but one who came was His Holiness Radhanath Swami. He was in Bombay to deal with his visa, and at the time, he had this sort of very simple white cloth and I think he had matted hair, and he was sort of a Shaivite. And so, he would come to our camp, and he gives me the credit for being the first one to engage him in service in ISKCON, because I was kind of the commander of the whole pandal and Tamal Krishna Goswami was overall in charge.

So, we would distribute BTGs in Boston, the main thing was just to get them to take it in their hand, and then they look at it and sort of get attached to it, and if you like it, you give a donation. So, I was doing the same thing Prabhupada planned in advance. I got a Hindi BTG printed in Japan before we even got there, to India. And so, I was at the book table, I was handing out the BTGs, and it was different from Boston because the people would take the BTGs and just walk away with them without paying.

So, I went to one of our main advisors, Sakshi Gopal, and I told him what was happening. He said, “Oh, you can’t do that here.” So, “What do we do?” He said, “Well, because they have to hold it, they have to look at it.” He said, “Well, what you do is you poke a hole in the corner of each magazine, and then you thread a string through the hole and tie it to the leg of the table, and that way, they can hold it and look at it and see if they want it, but they can’t walk away with that.”

So, I thought, Okay, that’s the way they do things here. So then, this young man, Richard, was spending a lot of time at the pandal site. So, I said, “Would you like to do some service?” He said, “Yes.” So, I said, “Well, I want you to poke holes in the corner of all these magazines, okay?” That was his first service in ISKCON.

Another devotee who came from the pandal was His Holiness Lokanath Swami. He was from a village in Maharashtra state but he had come to Bombay, and he saw the advertisements. And we didn’t really notice him at the pandal sight, but he was very polite and proper. By then we had Juhu, the land, nothing was really built on it, and he sent a letter. Actually, he went to a typing school. I mean, in those days, it was very rare to own the typewriter. So, he went to a typing school, and he had them type up a letter of application to join.

It was addressed to the temple president. I was the temple president, and in it, he quoted the publicity that we had for the pandal, “I went to the pandal, I enjoyed the spectacular āratis, ecstatic kirtan,” all the things from our publicity, “And I would like to make an application to join this institution, and please tell me what I have to do.” So, I wrote back, “Yes, please come.”

So, these pandal programs, they influenced thousands of people, if you consider twenty thousand people a day, and then thirty thousand on the weekend. And then Srila Prabhupada sent Tamal Krishna Goswami and me to Calcutta to do one there, and that one had even more people coming. So, it had a tremendous impact on people, and Prabhupada always wanted his books distributed. And even devotees joined these programs. So, yes, that’s a different kind of pioneering.

Yes, Prabhupada was always daring. I think that’s related, he is always daring and willing to take risks, and we have to do that. And when we do that, we see how Krishna intervenes. If we stay within our comfort zones, okay, we are in our comfort zone, it’s nothing different. But when we take risks, let’s say the Boston temple, we didn’t know where we were going to get the money to make the payments, but we could see Krishna intervenes, we can see how Krishna reciprocates.

And so, Prabhupada gave that example of going for a rhinoceros. It’s something beyond your capacity and that can be done in subtle ways, but it doesn’t necessarily need to go to a new geographical area. It can mean to try something new, like our godbrother His Holiness Śrīdhara Swami Maharaja in Juhu. He had the idea that you could raise funds by mail, and at the time, that was unheard of. And to send out the mail, it was going to take a lot of money in ordinary terms, and the devotees were saying, “You can’t do it, people won’t give like that.”

When he did it, he took that risk, it was a primary effort. It was extremely successful and he did another mail order and more funds came in. And then other temples started to invite us and show us how to do it. Usually, when you do some pioneering, there is resistance or opposition, but that’s also part of it. Because of all these different pioneering efforts, ISKCON has become what it is and where we are. And we want to just keep that spirit.

Hare Krishna.

Devotee: It’s hard to keep up with Giriraj Maharaja. He is a real guy in here, I’m just following in his footsteps. Pioneering or preaching always has its challenges. I was just reflecting, I couldn’t reflect too much, it’s so interesting what Maharaja is saying, kind of in a blank, but I was just thinking how my next phase of being in ISKCON was being put in management, which I had no inclination to do, I had no ability to do, but somehow or another, that’s what I ended up doing right after my saṅkīrtana phase.

And even when I became the temple president of the first temple, of being temple president of Costa Rica for about three weeks, I got replaced. And I went to open another temple in Panama. I got put in jail and I got replaced, and then I went to Columbia. And there was already a temple that I was supposed to take over, and then I got replaced. And I went to Ecuador and the temple had closed. I had to reopen, and I reopened it.

It was an interesting experience because when I took over the temple, it was nine months behind in rent, and the person who owned the house was a colonel in the army. And in those countries, at that time, it was very dictatorial. So, he was basically threatening the devotees and they didn’t know what to do, so I went there and tried sending the devotees out of the saṅkīrtana, and they would just go to the beach.

So, one day, I said, “Prabhus, guess what?” I went and talked to the colonel, and I said, “Well, I was also in the army.” And they said, “Well, what are we going to do?” I said, “Well, if you can trust me, I promise I’ll pay you, but if we are just going to have to move out of there, I don’t want to make any more debt.”

So, the devotees came back, they were on saṅkīrtana, their version of saṅkīrtana. And I said, “We are going to do something a little different. Tomorrow, we are leaving this place, we are going on traveling saṅkīrtana.” And the only book we had, we had ten thousand Nectar of Devotion.

So, we were in Ecuador, going through all these villages, simple people with indigenous dress, giving them Nectar of Devotion. That was one thing. I think many devotees who did book distribution in those days, any time a book came out, we had to distribute that book so that we could distribute enough books to print the next book.

So, I remember distributing. I don’t think there is any country in the world that has more Nectar of Devotions, and I just remember earlier that when Śrī Caitanya-caritāmṛta, it was being printed. I just remember in the airport, I was in New Orleans airport, and New Orleans always had this great heavy mood and people rushing in, and they wanted to go enjoy.

Big business kind of people who push you aside, and I remember I was distributing until we left four, this heavy-duty businessman. And so, I distributed one book, and this man, who I guess was waiting for his flight, sat down. I didn’t notice him when he came up. Big, maybe six foot five, runner posing figure, comes up to me with this book. And I thought, Well, he is going to give it back, he is going to want his money back.

He said, “I was reading your book, and I just can’t understand this person that gets caught up in the fishnet and goat [Unintelligible 00:46:30], can you explain it to me?” And I said, “Well, yes. If you just keep reading, it becomes apparent.” I can’t explain Lord Chaitanya falling in a fishnet, he said, “Okay, thank you very much.” That was the one good experience I’ve had.

But the point is that there were many challenges in saṅkīrtana, and as I took up more leadership positions, then I ended up going to Brazil, becoming the saṅkīrtana leader for the country. And then Hridayananda Maharaja had some heart problems, so he just called me in the room and he said, “Okay, you just take over, I’m leaving.” “When are you leaving, who is going to train me?” “But I’m leaving in about thirty minutes.” I said, “Well, I don’t even know what to do.” And he said, “Well, just preach.” And I said, “Well, yes, but what about. . .?” And he said, “Well, Jagjivan will train you up.” So, I went to Jagjivan as he was getting in his car, and he said, “Yes, I’ve got to go.”

And another type of pioneering was taking positions, like Maharaja said. And in those days, you usually had three or four positions. One time, I was a temple president, cook, treasurer, and everything else that had any level of responsibility. So, then I became regional secretary, and then after a series of very great. . . I mean, ISKCON, especially after the disappearance of Srila Prabhupada, faced many challenges. And I personally think that that part of ISKCON’s history was, of course, there are always tests and there are trials, but there was that time from when Srila Prabhupada left until about 1986–87—so many challenges, and it seemed at some points in time, how are we going to go on?

I remember Srila Prabhupada’s disappearance day. I was in Nicaragua doing saṅkīrtana, I couldn’t do saṅkīrtana. For some reason, nothing went right that day. And that night. . . No, it was the day after because we were one day behind. So, on the 15th, we got the news that Prabhupada had left. And I was thinking, How will I go on? How would the movement go on? How would anything go on? 

And all through those years, there were so many challenges like that, and it was Srila Prabhupada’s example, Srila Prabhupada’s determination, at least in my experience, that brought us through. I mean, you can imagine that the oldest devotees in the movement, when Srila Prabhupada left, were in their mid-twenties, late twenties, and the oldest devotees were in their early thirties. And Prabhupada turned over this worldwide movement with the most exalted transcendental philosophy, to all these young people who, the oldest of which had been in the movement for eleven years and ten years. Most of them eight or nine or five years.

And I just remember that phase of ISKCON history was very trying, and so I was just thinking as Maharaja was speaking about different types of pioneering, that one type of pioneering or accepting risks is accepting the challenge that comes to us each day, which I very much experienced in those years. That one thing after another, and somehow or other, that we pulled through by the strength of Srila Prabhupada and those devotees who had been trained by Srila Prabhupada, their determination and their perseverance to fulfill Srila Prabhupada’s desire in the face of so many challenges.

We all have our challenges. As Krishna says to Arjuna, viṣame samupasthitam, “In this moment of crisis, why are you thinking like this, Arjuna?” Kutas tvā kaśmalam idaṁ, “Where is this impurity coming from?” And I was thinking how many times that I have reflected on that particular verse during those times, and how each one of us. . . Another type of pioneering is just to go through those challenges that maya places before us on a daily basis. And to maintain our Krishna consciousness, taking the risk, “I have these duties, I have these responsibilities, family, work, life. What am I supposed to do in life? I’m studying, I’m working, serving.”

And always accepting that challenge and putting Krishna consciousness in the forefront, making Krishna consciousness our priority. This is a type of pioneering that all of us are obliged to do. And then, I just remember a real. . . Of course, I’m going quite a bit ahead of Maharaja because I came in later so everything, my changes, my experiences in ISKCON’s history were more in those years, in the late seventies, early eighties.

But I just remember in 1987, it seemed like the dark clouds and challenges just kind of started dissipating and clearing away. And ISKCON, there was a real hope, and then there have been big challenges all through that, through the years after that, one thing after another.

And I always thought that every challenge that came to the movement, historically, I won’t go into the details of each one, but every one that came was an opportunity to experience the value of Krishna consciousness. How by facing these challenges and struggling through them, we realize what a transcendental gem, what a transcendental value that Krishna consciousness has in our lives. And this is a type of pioneering going ahead internally, and becoming stronger in one’s Krishna consciousness.

We did that. Those of us who had leadership positions, especially being in GBC, I’ve been at GBC now for thirty years, twenty-eight years—quite a stint, it’s full of challenges. But those challenges throughout the years, and there are still challenges every day, every year, in the Mayapur meetings. But I see that in spite of all these challenges and difficulties that may appear here and there, I get my share of them and we all do, that it strengthens one’s Krishna consciousness so much, to accept them as opportunities to go on and participate more and more, and see this all as Krishna’s mercy.

Quite an interesting way of how Krishna reciprocates. I was thinking that when the Maharaja was speaking about Lord Jagannatha, how sometimes we come before the Deity, we are looking for a sign, “What am I supposed to do?” We speak to our devotees, we speak to our spiritual master, or we speak to someone. It seems practically impossible to go on at times, so many challenges, but those challenges to me established the worth. As Srila Prabhupada said, the matchless gift is Krishna consciousness, that Krishna places these things before us, just as Arjuna had his challenge and Krishna instructed him.

And we have these challenges, these moments of crisis. And reflecting back on the history of ISKCON, and seeing how great devotees like His Holiness Giriraj Maharaja, all these years of pioneering in different places, that they become the beacons that give us the strength and the ability to go on and on in Krishna consciousness.

So, just thinking how every day, in one sense, is a milestone in the life of a devotee, and the more we accept those. . . Like Queen Kunti, she said, “Let me experience these difficulties again and again because it makes me see the nature of this world, and it brings me closer to Your lotus feet.” Anyway, just some thoughts I had while you were speaking.”

Hare Krishna.

Giriraj Swami: To move along now with the program, we will have questions or comments, but because of what Maharaja said, I do feel obliged to comment on one thing. He mentioned me, but I actually feel I’m being carried along by my godbrothers maybe, and so many devotees, sincere devotees. And it reminded me of one exchange I had with His Holiness Niranjana Swami when he was staying with me in Santa Barbara once.

Somehow, we were talking about Srila Gaura Govinda Swami Maharaja, and I don’t know why, but I asked His Holiness Niranjana Swami, “Do you pray to Srila Gaura Govinda Swami Maharaja?” And he said, “Yes, I do, and I pray to you too.” But I was on a different topic, I didn’t really deal with that, just didn’t entertain it. And then the next morning, actually, his last morning, he was going to be leaving, I said, “You said that you pray to me too, is that really true?” He said, “Yes.” I think he listed a few godbrothers that he prays for every morning. And I said, “That’s funny, because I also pray to you.” And he said, “Well, I don’t know how that works, because I’m getting all my strength from all of you.”

So, I think that in all these challenges, and of course, we have the Deities, we have the holy name, we have Srila Prabhupada, but we have each other. And really taking shelter of each other propels us and sustains us. And so, we have to really appreciate and value every devotee who is part of this great mission.

Hare Krishna.

So, are there comments or questions? He was first.

Devotee: I have one question. You were speaking about taking risks in pioneering, and I find that with risk, there is a fine line between risk and gamble. Sometimes when we are starting a project where we are doing some preaching, we have to make a decision on the spot. So, how can we gauge if it’s a risk or gamble?

Giriraj Swami: That’s a good question. Well, there is a phrase, calculated risk. We shouldn’t take reckless risk, but we can take calculated risks in which we calculate the pros and cons, what we could gain or we could lose, what the chances are of success or chances are of loss. And then, that’s prayerful surrender. Of course, this also has its risks, but sometimes you get an answer within your heart. Because you are on the spot, you need to make a decision, you just throw up your hands and totally surrender in prayer, “Please guide me here.” And you can get an answer that way.

Devotee: But just what you said, I just remembered out of the twenty-six qualities of a Vaishnava, the svarūpa-lakṣaṇa, the essential quality of surrender. And in that surrender, that is the risk. I’m just thinking that otherwise, I’m going to depend on Krishna, and that’s what surrender means. So, when we talk about risk, we are really talking about surrendering. So, it doesn’t mean risk that you put y Prabhupada’s assets into danger.

Even Srila Prabhupada sometimes chastised devotees that they put their life into risk unnecessarily. One time, before his tour in Pakistan, he said, “Come back, don’t take this risk, don’t put yourself into that much danger.” But the real risk is sometimes an internal risk, “Do I surrender more or do I, as Maharaja said, remain in the comfort zone?” So, this is an aspect.

Devotee: Hare Krishna. So, Maharaja, in your experiences, you have so many challenges. So, how often would you take those challenges to Srila Prabhupada?

Giriraj Swami: Well, we took our lead from Srila Prabhupada, as far as how much we should bring to him. But we were very dependent on him in India. His attitude in America was more, “You are Americans, you are from here and you know what to do here.” But in India, we didn’t know what to do. And so, as Tamal Krishna Goswami often used to say when he was the GBC for India, “Actually, I’m not the GBC for India, Prabhupada is the GBC for India.” And we also didn’t want to bother him unnecessarily. I just remember once, he actually got very upset because we were coming to him with so many questions and he said, “I’m not an answer-giving machine.” And then he just said, “That’s it.” And we just had to act according to that.

So, what Maharaja brought up about the challenge after Srila Prabhupada left was not having his immediate association to answer our questions. And many times, we did ask him even before he left, “What would we do after you leave?” So, Satsvarupa Maharaja asked, “Now you are here and we have questions we can ask you, but what about when you are not here, how do we get our answers?”

And Srila Prabhupada said, “The holy name of Krishna and Krishna Himself are the same, do you realize this fact?” And I found many places where Srila Prabhupada would make the same point, that by offenseless chanting of the holy name, answers come. Once, I asked a related question, “Srila Prabhupada, now you are with us so everything is going well, but what if in the future when you are not with us, ISKCON falls from the standard, what should I do?” And he replied, I was a fairly new devotee then, and he replied, “You are also one of the important members, so you work for the correction, but don’t leave.” So, I took that as a very significant personal instruction. I tend to think that it has general application, but I guess that could be an individual matter.

Devotee: Firstly, we are here to celebrate and commemorate the last fifty years of Srila Prabhupada starting ISKCON, and I was wondering how you feel the next fifty years are going to go. This is reputed as being the fastest growing religious movement ever, and I was wondering how the next fifty years are going and also, what each of us individually should be doing over the coming fifty years.

Devotee: I don’t anticipate being around in fifty years, but maybe in another body, but if I reflect on fifty years from now, fifty years ago, ISKCON had ten people, now it has millions. So, just by projecting that, I see that we should start making major conquests. Srila Prabhupada said about certain places like Mauritius and Fiji, that these places can be the first Krishna conscious country. Of course, he said that about many places. Actually, Srila Prabhupada, one time, he went to New-Vrindavan and he said, “Radha-Vrindavan Chandra are the most beautiful Deities,” and then he went to London, and he said, “Radha-Gokulananda are the most beautiful Deities.” One devotee had been with him in New-Vrindavan. So, he said, “Yes, Krishna is absolute everywhere.” So, the point is what can each one of us do; do as much as we can and a little more. That’s what makes the movement grow. When we grow, going back to Maharaja’s example, going beyond the comfort zone.

When you stay in the comfort zone, you don’t grow, and that around you doesn’t grow either. When we all go out of that comfort zone in our chanting, in our service, in our spiritual life in general, then the movement expands and grows very wonderfully. So, I would say that’s a very important fact. Of course, you don’t want to get too far out of your comfort zone, you might stumble. But always going a little bit beyond, always pushing ourselves a little more, that’s what Prabhupada. . . Maharaja attested to the fact, that Prabhupada didn’t just push a little bit, Prabhupada pushed every day and pushed a lot.

So, at least we should take upon ourselves to, every day, put a little bit more quality in my chanting, a little bit more quality in my service. Try to do a little bit more for this movement, and that will make whatever has happened now, hopefully minus some of the major challenges that we went through. And I’ve seen over the past maybe ten years, I’ve seen the challenges have become. . . Certainly, there are big challenges, but it seems like they are not quite as ominous as before, which I see as a good sign.

On the other hand, Srila Prabhupada said, “If there is no challenge, it means we are not preaching.” Otherwise, if there is no opposition in a materialistic commingling society, if there is no opposition, then that may indicate I’m not doing so much preaching. I was happy to see some opposition, not from the devotees, we don’t want that kind of opposition, but opposition from the materialistic society. But we should be happy when we see a little opposition. I think that’s my reflection on your question.

Giriraj Swami: One very major event that is coming up soon will be the opening of the TOVP, Temple of Vedic Planetarium, and that will really push the movement forward tremendously. Many thoughtful devotees, even friends who are Gaudiya Vaishnavas outside ISKCON, see that this is going to have a tremendous impact on the world. And they are suggesting that we really get our house in order to be able to receive all the people who are going to be coming.

If you are having a program at your home and fifty people are coming or even twenty people, you really want your house to be in order. But we are probably going to be having millions of people come. And having our house in order means, yes, physically it should be in order, but it means also philosophically, to be really clear about things. And as many of the contentious issues as possible, we should come to some resolution on those based on sadhu, shastra, and guru.

So, yes, I think it’s going to be huge. It’s already expanding very quickly. And for our success, we have to cooperate. As many of you probably heard, Tamal Krishna Goswmi said to Srila Prabhupada towards the end, “Devotees love you so much,” and Srila Prabhupada said, “Your love for me will be shown by how you cooperate to keep this institution together.”

And that cooperation really means to be free from false ego. And that means to put Prabhupada and Krishna at the center. So, that is a very important requirement. I mean, what Maharaja said is absolutely true. Individually, we have to constantly be purifying ourselves and dealing with the internal challenges, and being pioneers, and overcoming different challenges that we face individually. And then also to work cooperatively. But I would say in a word, when one of our life members and supporters in Calcutta asked Srila Prabhupada a question, “What is the future of your movement?” And Srila Prabhupada said in a word, “Bright.”

But later, in the program at Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan, Srila Prabhupada, this is Kanhayalal Mushi, she also asked Srila Prabhupada, “What is the future of the movement?” And he said the same thing, “Bright,” but he added a qualification, “Bright as long as they follow my instructions.” But it is bright.

Hare Krishna.