Srila Prabhupada Katha

Speaker: We are very happy to have, I know it’s been a few months, Maharaja, we have been communicating. So, we were very excited that you will come and spend at least one week here. But somehow, that didn’t work out. But here you are here. And is it okay? Should I give a brief introduction? I know a brief introduction is not enough, but if we miss something, you can add as well. [laughter]

So, Hare Krishna, devotees. We are very fortunate to have HH Giriraj Swami Maharaja. I had the good fortune to assist him a few years back. I forgot, we have Mother Sangeeta Mataji also on this call today, and Vamanadeva Prabhu as well, I’m hoping. I didn’t see their faces, but I saw their names. And is it okay, Vishnugada Prabhu, if I introduce him? Would you like to introduce to our Delaware and Philadelphia congregation?

Speaker: You’re doing a good job, good.

Speaker: Thank you. So, just a brief introduction, I got it from his website itself. HH Giriraj Swami Maharaja, who in childhood was known as Glenn Phillip. He is an only son. His father was a lawyer in Chicago, and later he was appointed as judge. So, basically, he comes from a very well-educated, well-to-do family. And in March 1969, after finishing his graduation at Brandeis University in Boston, he met Srila Prabhupada and he got attracted.

And this is the interesting point. For me, literally money attracted me so I came to America. But for Maharaja, even though he had everything, he got attracted to Srila Prabhupada’s movement. And after graduation from Brandeis, he accepted initiation from Srila Prabhupada, named as Giriraj dasa, he was not a sannyasi at that time. Then, he was a leading member at Boston Center, and soon was given the opportunity to go to India to assist Srila Prabhupada in his mission. Many of us know how he struggled, he worked so hard to establish the Bombay and Juhu temple, and I’m hoping that he’s going to share something about this.

So, in 1972, he was appointed as president of ISKCON Bombay and trustee of Bhaktivedanta Book Trust. And in his journey, later, he assisted Srila Prabhupada in many of his projects, but after Prabhupada’s departure in 1977, he was awarded the renounced order of life as HH Giriraj Swami Maharaja, and also appointed president of ISKCON’s Board of Trustees in India.

In 1982, he was appointed to ISKCON’s Governing Body Commission, GBC, and he went to oversee many places—Mauritius, South Africa, Spain, Portugal, Sri Lanka, Pakistan. And he’s really never ending. He wrote many books. One of the books I have in my hand, I don’t know if you can see, but I’m going to ask him to speak about it. But I would like to ask Dronacharya Prabhu also to welcome Maharaja with some welcoming words. Dronacharya Prabhu, are you ready? Would you like to?

Dronacharya Prabhu: Hare Krishna. Hare Krishna, everyone. Hare Krishna, Maharaja, it’s a great honor to have you. We don’t want to hold those up too long, Krishna Kirtan, you just gave an introduction. I really just want to say what an honor it is to have you, Maharaja. And tonight, it’s a collection of the Philadelphian and Delaware devotees, and we’re known that our states are joined up against each other and we’re really close in proximity. But during this Covid period, there hasn’t been a whole lot of connection.

And [Unintelligible 00:04:52] Prabhu, he mentioned how Srila Prabhupada wanted us to work together on projects and things like that. And this is an opportunity for us to come together and hear together. We can listen to kṛṣṇa-kathā together. And I’m really enthusiastic about this opportunity. We have a lot of saintly devotees here tonight, and we’re truly blessed with all the inauspiciousness going on in the world, this is a place right now of complete protection and mercy. Maharaja, thank you so much. Hare Krishna.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna. So, I’ll begin by singing the maṅgala-ācaraṇa prayers, a little kirtan, and then I will speak. Seeing HH Jayadvaita Swami on the screen, my mind is eager to hear him speak, but I guess I’ll do my duty and I’ll speak.  

So, it is a great honor and pleasure and privilege for me to be with you all today. We are here by the mercy of Srila Prabhupada. There was a devotee in England who told his son, who was, you could say, born into the movement, that he may take for granted having Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada’s followers as spiritual guides. But for someone like him, the father, it was a great search and struggle to eventually find Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada’s paramparā. And so, he was advising his son not to take Srila Prabhupada and his paramparā for granted.

In my case, also, it was a long search for me to find my perfect master. In high school, I had the idea of doing good for others, and at that time, I thought that doing good for others meant taking care of their bodies. So, I was the president of, it had a different name, but in effect, the future doctors of America club. But then, when I went to college, I saw that there were some people who were suffering more due to their minds than due to their bodies and that the mental anguish could be greater than the physical pain.

So then, I had the idea to become a psychologist, and at Brandeis University, the chairman of the psychology department was Abraham Maslow, and he developed what he called a third force in psychology. The first two, one was behaviorism, which studied stimulus and response. The famous proponent of behaviorism was B. F. Skinner. And then there was psychoanalysis, which was founded by Sigmund Freud. And so, Professor Maslow said that he didn’t want to study rats like the behaviorists, and he didn’t want to study diseased people like the psychoanalyst. He wanted to study healthy people. And he developed a whole theory with a hierarchy of needs, and he was pointing towards something beyond the body and mind, and he spoke about self-actualized people.

So, I had the idea, from high school, actually, to find perfect happiness. And then, I realized that one could not get perfect happiness by any material means, that I had to adopt some spiritual method. And then, by reading and introspection, I realized that I couldn’t follow a spiritual process on my own, but I needed a guru. And then, the focus of my quest was to find my guru, my perfect master.

So, Brandeis University itself, in the psychology department, invited many gurus, and one of them was Swami Sacidananda. And Swami Sacidananda, I don’t remember everything he said in his lecture, but the one thing I remember is he said that by yoga, you can gain control of your involuntary muscles. And he gave the example of the intestines, that you can command your intestines; ascending colon advance, then transverse colon advance, then descending colon advance, and then rectum release. So, I thought that was very interesting, but it didn’t particularly satisfy my thirst for spiritual knowledge, but I thought, Anyway, it was just an introductory talk.

So, I had another Professor, James Clay, who was involved in inviting many of these guest speakers and I told him that, because Swami Sacidananda was based in New York and Brandeis was in Boston, so I told my professor that I wanted to ride in the car with him to the airport so I could speak with him. And my professor said that his car was already full, but some of his students were going to the airport and I could go in the car with them.

So, I joined them, and in the car, they were discussing all the different types of food they missed since they had moved into the ashram. I thought, Well, that’s odd. They just heard their guru speak and all they’re thinking about is the food they were missing since they joined the ashram. I know they mentioned pizza, that was one. But anyway, I thought, Well, they’re just the students, let’s see the master. So, when we got to the airport, there was Swami Sacinandana. And he had flowing hair and a beard and a twinkle in his eye, he was the very picture of Indian spirituality. But at the airport, he very warmly and tightly embraced an attractive young lady, who I imagine must have been a follower of his, and seeing that, I thought, He’s not my perfect master.

So then, back at Brandeis, I heard that there was a weekend retreat being held at a Zen ashram in Rochester, New York, conducted by Philip Kapleau, who was supposed to be a certified enlightened Zen master, certified by another certified enlightened Zen master in Japan. So, I drove to the ashram. And he had written a book called The Three Pillars of Zen, which I had read. So, I drove to the ashram, and some of the students opened the door, and they seemed sort of morose, not very happy. And I thought, Well, that’s odd too. But they’re just the students, we can’t really judge.

So, they admitted me, and one of the first exercises was that we all sat around the perimeter of a room facing the wall and the master gave us a koan, it’s like a riddle, to contemplate while facing the wall with our backs erect. And an example of a koan is, “I’ve often heard the sound of two hands clapping. What is the sound of one hand clapping?” And the idea is that by meditating on this koan or riddle, you go beyond the limitations of the mind. So, we were sitting facing the wall, and the master would go around with a stick. And if he detected that any of the students’ minds were wandering, he would give them a hit with the stick. So, I mean, I didn’t get hit with the stick but I was trying, I was really sincere, I wanted to find the perfection of life, so I was following whatever he said.

So then, there was a lunch break, and the students went to the dining hall and they had wooden benches and tables. And I sat at the table with the master, and one of the students complained to the master that he had unnecessarily gotten angry with the student, and the master replied, “Yes, you’re right, I shouldn’t have lost my temper.” Now, I had read in the Zen books that an enlightened soul appears ordinary. So, I thought, Well, maybe this is part of it, maybe he just appears ordinary, apologizing for losing his temper, and so on.

But then, maybe a month or two later, the same Zen master was invited to Boston by Houston Smith, who taught religion or comparative religions at MIT, so I thought, Let me see the Zen master again. So, during his talk, during the questions and answers, someone asked him about Vedanta, and he replied, “I have enough trouble keeping up with Zen, don’t ask me about Vedanta.” And then I thought, He’s not my perfect master.

So then, J. Krishnamurti came to Brandeis, and he had a morning session and an evening session. And it wasn’t in a big auditorium but the room was packed. So, after the morning session, I asked Professor Clay that I wanted to speak to Mr. Krishnamurti, and he said, “Why do you want to meet him?” And I said, “Well, I want to see if maybe he’s my guru.” And Professor Clay replied, “He doesn’t even accept money, and he certainly doesn’t accept disciples.” So, I thought, That’s odd. If he has knowledge and he can actually help someone, why should he refuse for the sake of being renounced? So, I thought, He is not my perfect master.

So, like this, I went to many. I heard that there was an enlightened Professor of psychology at Antioch College, and I thought, I’ll try him. So, I drove to Antioch, Ohio, and with great eagerness and expectation, it was a Friday afternoon, I went to the Professor’s office and asked to meet the Professor. And his secretary outside his office said, “Well, you can’t because he’s out playing golf.” I didn’t say it, but she could see the expression on my face, “Out playing golf?” So, she replied, “That’s his Zen.” So, “All right.” But I did come all that distance so I didn’t want to just go back.

So, I went to the Student Union and I was speaking with the students, telling them about my spiritual quest looking for a guru, and they told me that a Swami had come to the campus. And I don’t remember his name, I just remember the last three syllables of his name were ānanda, but there are a lot of Swamis whose names end with ānanda. So, I never really found out who he was. But they said something very interesting, that he said that God or the Guru is sitting on the lotus of your heart, and you can speak to Him, and He will speak with you. And that was very attractive, I wanted to know who that was, who was that guru in my heart with whom I could converse. It was the first time in all the searching I came in touch with anything resembling a personal philosophy of God.

So, I went back. There were others I tried, and for the sake of time, I won’t tell the story of each of them but suffice to say there were many others, famous at the time, prominent at the time, but I was not satisfied with any of them. So, I almost gave up hope, practically I gave up hope, I was so discouraged because I tried so many and I couldn’t find my perfect master. And on top of it, I had a vague impression of what my perfect master looked like, very vague, and he didn’t have hair, and all the others pretty much had long, flowing hair. So, I gave up. I was hopeless, so I gave up.

So, one night, I had some friends over to my apartment. At that stage, I was living off the campus and I was vegetarian by then also, so we had soup and pasta and salad. And then, we were going to go to the movies. In those days, they had art houses which showed mainly foreign films. But that day, on campus, I saw a poster: “Swami Bhaktivedanta—Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, 7 p.m., Schwartz Auditorium.” But I didn’t pay much attention because I was already hopeless. But after dinner, I kept thinking of that poster, and something inside of me was compelling me, “You must go to this lecture.”

So, I told my friends and there was a whole hue and a cry, “We were supposed to be going to the movies.” And I was sort of a docile type, I didn’t want to displease anyone, “Well, okay.” But then, again, something inside my heart was just compelling me, “You must go to this lecture.” So, I brought it up again, and they said, “We’re going to the movies.” I said, “All right, we’ll go to the later show,” they were grumbling.

And I had a lady friend and she was very upset, and she raised her voice and she said, “Why can’t you be like a normal person? Why do you always have to be running after all these swamis and yogis?” And I raised my voice. And I wanted to go along with them, but I was just being compelled to go. So, “Why do you have to keep going to all these swamis and yogis?” So, I said, “All right! This will be the last one I ever go to.”

So, we went to the auditorium, and because of all the arguing and discussing, we missed the lecture, but we got there in time for the last kirtan. And Srila Prabhupada was on the stage and Satsvarupa was leading the kirtan. And the inside of the Schwarz Auditorium was bare brick, quite tasteful but it was bare brick, and the sound of the kirtan was reverberating off the walls. And students from the audience were climbing up on the stage and joining the kirtan with Srila Prabhupada and the devotees. So, I had my friends on both sides of me, and I thought, If I climb up on this stage, it’s going to be too much for them, that won’t be able to take it. So, I just stood up in place, and I was sort of swaying back and forth.

And then, the kirtan ended and Satsvarupa announced that if anyone is driving to Boston or Harvard Square, they should meet the devotees in the lobby because the devotees needed a lift. Because back then, none of the devotees owned a motor vehicle. So, I went out to the lobby, and I was going to Harvard Square to see the movie, and the first devotee I spoke with was Baradraja Prabhu, who is the father of Gaura Vani, who’s famous for leading kirtans.

And Baradraja Prabhu, he was so high on Krishna consciousness, he just started speaking about the Bhagavad-gītā and how Krishna showed His universal form to Arjuna and Arjuna was trembling, and then he asked Krishna to show him His four-armed form. And he was saying how the universal form was more effulgent than thousands and millions of suns. And then, Arjuna asked Krishna to show him His original two-handed form, and he was just going on and on. I mean, all the other students of all the other gurus, or so-called gurus, they all seemed a bit dull and morose or mundane, but he was really way up there.

So, I said, “I have a station wagon and I’m driving to Harvard Square, so I can take some devotees with me.” So, they all piled into my station wagon, and in the front seat was a lady devotee named Jahnava and my girlfriend or whatever, lady friend. And then in the back compartment was my best friend Gary with Satsvarupa and others. I mean, everyone was really sort of crammed in. And from the back, I heard Gary say that everything is void. And Satsvarupa replied, “There is no void in the creation of God,” and they were arguing. And I thought, I could resolve it with something that I read in the Zen book. So, I turned around and I said, “It’s not void and it’s not, not void, but to give it a name, we call it the void.” So, that ingenious pronouncement had absolutely no effect whatsoever, and they continued with their arguing.

And I thought, I have so many questions of my own, so I started to ask Jahnava. So, I asked about Yogananda, because I read a book called The Autobiography of a Yogi by him. She said, “Have you been to Yogananda’s ashram? He’s just a shopkeeper. Whatever you want, he keeps it in stock. You want Krishna, he has Krishna. You want Durga, he has Durga. You want Ganesh, he has Ganesh. You want bhakti, he has bhakti. You want yoga, he’s got yoga. You want jnana, he’s got jnana.” And then, she said, “At his ashram, he has a shrine to Mahatma Gandhi as a worker for world peace. Mahatma Gandhi was not a worker for world peace, he was working for India’s political independence. Yogananda doesn’t even know who Mahatma Gandhi was.” So, I thought, Okay, well, we’ll cross him off the list.

Then, I asked about Zen, and she said, “It’s like you’re watching a movie on a movie screen and you see all these images, but they’re not substantial. And if you withdraw your attention from the images on the screen, you’ll see there’s a beam of light. And if you follow the beam of light back, it comes to a point. But then, beyond the point, there’s a light bulb and a projector, and a person who’s running the projector.” And I thought, Wow! This is the best explanation of Zen I’ve ever heard, and it goes way beyond Zen. And I thought, This is amazing.

So, whatever question I asked, she had a perfect answer. And then, I thought, She’s just a young girl, she can’t be speaking all of this on her own authority, she must be speaking on the authority of her guru. I have to meet her guru. So, we got to Harvard Square and I left the devotees out of the car, and then I realized that I didn’t have the address, I didn’t know how to find them. So, I jumped out of the car and ran after the devotees, and the one who was walking the slowest, who was the one I caught up to first, his name was Patitapavana.

And Patitapavana, he said, “You see all these people? They’re just like sleepwalkers, they don’t know who they are or where they’re going.” I thought, Wow! Every one of these devotees is so profound. But then, I started to hear the honking of horns, and I realized that I’d left the car at the roundabout in Harvard Square and all the traffic was backed-up. So, I said, “Quick, can you give me the address to the temple? I want to come to the temple.” So, he gave me the address, and then the next night I went.

And, I couldn’t follow all of Srila Prabhupada’s lecture because the philosophy was very new to me, and also, his Indian accent was quite thick at that time. But I did hear him say that out of many thousands of men, one will seek perfection. I thought, That’s me, he’s talking about me. So then, at the end of the lecture, he asked for questions, and one other person asked first. It was good, basically, the answer that Srila Prabhupada gave was that the cloud is created by the sun. The sun evaporates the water. The cloud is created by the sun but the cloud can cover our vision of the sun, but it doesn’t actually cover the sun. So, that was sort of his explanation of maya.

And then, I asked my question, I was burning to ask, and I said, “There are so many swamis and yogis, and each one recommends a different process of self-realization, and each one says that his is the best. So, how do I know which is actually the best?” And Srila Prabhupada answered so intelligently. He said, “What is your goal? Do you want to serve God, or do you want to become God?” Because I was asking what is the best means, but the best means to what end?

So, he was asking, “So, what is your goal?” And he said, “If you want to become God, that means you’re not God now. And how can not-God become God? God is God. He’s substantially God. He doesn’t have to become God by practicing yoga or meditation.” And then he said, “Krishna is God when He’s on the lap of Mother Yasoda. He’s God when He’s speaking the Bhagavad-gītā to Arjuna. He’s always God, He doesn’t have to become God.” And he said, “God is in your heart, and if you want to serve Him, He will help you. But if you want to become God, you’re only cheating yourself, because why should God help the competition?” And he said, “But if you sow the seed of service to God and water it by chanting, God will give the sunlight and fresh air and everything to make that grow.”

As Srila Prabhupada was speaking, I had the distinct impression that he was seeing right through me, seeing out of the temple room, down the roads leading to my apartment, he was seeing into my apartment, into my bathroom, to the wall of my bathroom where I had written in my own hand and very ornate colorful lettering: YOU ARE GOD! So, I thought, He knows everything. He knows everything about me.

But meanwhile, back in the temple room, Srila Prabhupada asked me, “So, do you want to serve God, or do you want to become God?” And by then, I knew I couldn’t become God, so I began to say, “I want to serve God,” but I knew I couldn’t cheat Srila Prabhupada, so I said, “Yes, I wanted to become God.” And Srila Prabhupada said, “Yes.” So then, I knew I had found my perfect master and I bowed my head down on the floor and I offered obeisances in surrender, I had found my perfect master.

And I kept my head down for a long time, mainly in surrender, but also, I was afraid to see the other people in the room because I thought that they would all be glaring at me, He wanted to become God, he wanted to become God. So, I kept my head down for a long time. But then, I heard sounds that indicated that food was being served. And the atmosphere in the temple room, a small storefront, but the atmosphere in the temple room changed, and I could feel there was a very light and happy mood. So, I thought, All right, I think it’s safe, I can get up now. And I looked around, and yeah, everyone was happy, everyone was taking prasāda.

And then, a devotee brought me a plate of prasāda, and it was so colorful and aromatic. And I think the first thing I tried was a cauliflower pakora, deep fried, of course, and it was such an explosion of taste in my mouth, like nothing I had ever experienced before. And then, one by one, I tried the different preparations, and each one was better than the next. And I thought, Everything about Krishna consciousness is perfect; the guru, the philosophy, the process, the chanting, and the food. Everything is perfect. So, I surrendered, I found my perfect master. I don’t know how much time I have. I guess I’ll speak a little more.

Speaker: Yeah, please Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: So, the program was that Monday, Wednesday, and Friday evening, Srila Prabhupada would speak in the temple. And Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday, he would speak outside. Tuesday and Thursday were usually at a university, like he had spoken at Brandeis, and then Sunday was the Sunday love feast. So, one of the programs was at, I believe, Northeastern. So, it was a medium-sized classroom and there was a dais, Srila Prabhupada was sitting there, and there was a sort of a clear area in front of Srila Prabhupada, and then there were seats, chairs, where the students and staff were sitting.

So, during the last kirtan, I felt overcome with love. Just seeing the people in the room, I was just filled with love for them, and that sense of love extended beyond the classroom, beyond Boston, to the whole world and to the whole universe. And I felt a great sense of love and oneness, and I thought, Maybe this is one of the peak experiences that Professor Maslow wrote about.

But anyway, I was overcome, and at the end, I went up to Srila Prabhupada, and it was the first time I had ever approached him in that way. I mean, yes, after a talk, I would raise my hand and ask a question. I was so overcome, I went right up to him and I said, “This chanting is wonderful.” And he was a little raised up, and he looked down and he smiled. And then, he started to chuckle. His body was heaving, he was chuckling. And I knew he wasn’t laughing at me, but he was chuckling in ecstasy that, “This young man had experienced some of what kirtan is.”

So, maybe I’ll just tell one more story from that first day. So, Srila Prabhupada had a lot of preaching programs, as I mentioned, and one was at the Harvard University Divinity School. And he spoke similar to the way he would generally speak then at the universities. And then afterwards, so many hands shot up, because these Harvard students, I think they thought they were very smart, and they were, I mean, in a way, they were smart. So, they had a lot of questions, or challenges.

So, one of the young men said, “You said that by chanting Hare Krishna all problems can be solved. But in Russia, there were people who would chant the name of Jesus, but nothing changed. And then, when they had the Russian revolution, then things changed.” And Srila Prabhupada replied, “So, the people in Russia now, are they happy?” And the young man said, “No, they’re not happy.” And Srila Prabhupada said, “Then what was the use of this revolution?”

So then, another student raised his hand, he said, “You say that by repeating this chanting, you get this result. But couldn’t you just repeat anything, like, ‘One, two, three, one, two, three, one, two, three.’ Couldn’t you just repeat anything and get the same result?” And Srila Prabhupada said, “Of course, that is not possible. But if you want, you can try counting, and then you can try chanting.” And everyone cracked up, it was so funny, it was such a brilliant answer.

And then, one of them asked either, “Are you truly happy?” or “Have you seen God?” It was one of those two, but either way, Srila Prabhupada’s answer was, “If I tell you falsely that I have seen God or that I’m truly happy, will you believe me?” And the student said, “No.” And Srila Prabhupada replied, “Then what was the use of asking such a question?” So, one by one, he was addressing all the students’ questions, and in a way, you could say defeating them.

So, after the program, I was just sort of loitering amongst the students, listening to what they were speaking about Srila Prabhupada. And suddenly, Jadurani came rushing up to me, and affectionately imitating Srila Prabhupada’s voice, she said, “So, where is the driver?” I thought, Oh my God, I have to drive Srila Prabhupada. So, I went rushing out to the car. So, he got in and all the other devotees got in.

And I had a vague idea of how to get back to the temple, but when we had come for the program, it was daylight, but now it was dark, and after a while, I sort of realized that we were lost and I asked the other devotees, “Does anyone know the way?” And they didn’t know. And Srila Prabhupada was sitting next to me, in the passenger seat. He said, “Is not the driver supposed to know the way?” So, I thought, I didn’t know I was the driver! I just thought I was being a good guy giving everyone a lift! Anyway, eventually, we found our way back. So, I jumped out of the car and let Srila Prabhupada out, and I said, “I’m sorry for not knowing the way back and getting lost.” And Srila Prabhupada smiled at me with such compassion, and he said, “That’s all right.”

And I had seen how he had demolished all those brilliant students at Harvard, he could have demolished me also, but he didn’t, he was very kind and compassionate, he said, “That’s all right.” So, then I thought, Everything about Krishna consciousness really is perfect.

And then, after about a week or ten days, the devotees told me that Srila Prabhupada was leaving. I didn’t know that he was going to leave, I just thought he would always be in Boston. But I found out there are so many centers and he travels from one place to the other. So, they said, “Srila Prabhupada is leaving. Would you like to come to the airport to see him off?” So, I said, yes. So, I went, and at the airport, almost all the devotees were weeping. And I didn’t exactly understand it. So, I asked one of the lady devotees named Arundhati, and she replied, “Srila Prabhupada said that in the spiritual world, meeting and separation are both the same. Both are occasions of ecstasy.”

And that sounded like a perfect answer but I wasn’t sure how practical it was. So, the devotees stayed, in those days, you could go right up to the departure gate, and they just stood there until the airplane disappeared in the distance. And they said, “Srila Prabhupada said that when the spiritual master leaves, you should watch the airplane until it disappears in the sky just like the gopīs watched Krishna’s chariot when He was going from Vrindavan to Mathura, and they kept watching and until the last dust had settled.”

So, we went back to the temple. I was convinced of everything, but I still had that little doubt that, Everything in Krishna consciousness is perfect, but the one defect may be that the spiritual master has to leave. But I remembered Arundhati’s answer quoting Srila Prabhupada. And then, one day, a little thereafter, we were chanting hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana outside the Copley Square subway station, and I suddenly felt Srila Prabhupada’s presence descend on me, it was so palpable and tangible. And then, I thought, Yes, everything is perfect. And meeting and separation are the same in the sense that one can experience the presence of the spiritual master even in separation.

So, from then on, my goal became to introduce people to Srila Prabhupada, which I did very happily. But then, when he left, I thought, Well, what will be my service now? How will I introduce people to Srila Prabhupada? But then, I came to understand that by introducing them to his books and his process, his temples, his devotees, they can still get the benefit of Srila Prabhupada’s association. So, I’m always happy to not only introduce people to Srila Prabhupada, but try to help them become stronger in their faith, their relationship with Srila Prabhupada. Because I know whoever comes in touch with Srila Prabhupada, his or her life will benefit in innumerable ways, immeasurably.

So, thank you for this opportunity to join you all and to remember our glorious master, Srila Prabhupada. Hare Krishna. So now, if any of you have questions or comments, you can raise your hand.

Speaker: You can raise your hand using the Zoom, there’s a button for raising the hands.

Giriraj Swami: Okay.

Speaker: Yeah, if they can do it, we can call on them. Okay. So, we have one from Pranatha dasa Prabhu, please go ahead. And then Krishna Kirtan afterwards.

Pranatha dasa: Hare Krishna, Guru Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna, Pranatha.

Pranatha dasa: Please accept my humble obeisances, all glories to Prabhupada. Guru Maharaja, I would like to know about your initiation day, the day of your initiation, what was your feeling at the time you got the hari-nāma dīkṣā?

Giriraj Swami: Yes. Well, I was initiated by mail on July 5th. Srila Prabhupada was in Los Angeles. At that time, I mean, maybe because the letters came pretty fast. So, on my initiation day, I didn’t know it was my initiation day, it was the same thing. We were chanting on the streets, and I just had this realization or perception, that I’m not the body. I just felt completely liberated that I’m not the body, and feeling great appreciation, gratitude towards Srila Prabhupada. And then, the initiation letter came. I mentioned to some of the devotees what I had experienced when presumably being initiated, whether that could have been the result of it, and they said, “Yes, it’s very probable.” I was initiated by mail.

Pranatha dasa: Thank you, Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna.

Speaker: Krishna Kirtan Prabhu?

Krishna Kirtan Prabhu: Maharaja, thank you so much for your time and inspiring, it’s very purifying to hear and we know that time was very short and there’s so many things we won’t really hear about because the time was short. But you began with telling a story that we should not take that paramparā for granted.

Giriraj Swami: Yeah.

Krishna Kirtan Prabhu: And undoubtedly, I can feel that you mentioned that you also follow and understand the value of it and that you never took it for granted, right? So, because you personally have so much of struggle, not very easily, you saw so many spiritual masters and, but at the same time, you quoted manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye, thousands of men, that if you will try among few, hardly anyone, some will get perfection. So, it is still applicable to Krishna consciousness, knowing Krishna spoke it five thousand years ago , it is still applicable for the followers of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. We are very, very in a vast range of people coming and not everybody’s taking this movement seriously, right? Because for me, okay, I may have a little struggle, my children, they’re born into the movement. So, I’m just thinking, what is the hope for them? Is it the special mercy of Lord Chaitanya and Prabhupada that will work? Or that everyone has to be serious and careful about the progress?

Giriraj Swami: You’re talking about the children?

Krishna Kirtan Prabhu: Everybody actually, because even if you come to Hare Krishna, many times, you forget and you take it for granted, then we start demanding different things, “This should be like this, this should be like that” and forget the real purpose. So, my question is general for children, those who are born, they may not be taking it as very important, take it for granted. And those who are coming to the movement, they may also take it for granted.

Giriraj Swami: Well, we’ll start with the children. As HH Jayapataka Swami often says, they’re born in the Hare Krishna movement but they haven’t decided to join the Hare Krishna movement, and it’s up to us, the elders, by our words, by our example, by our love and care, to make them want to join the Hare Krishna movement. I mean, as far as people coming in touch with the movement, it’s true, manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu, they may not all be so serious, or sincere.

I mean, I had many friends, we were all spiritual seekers, and when I discovered Srila Prabhupada, I went to them and I said, “This is it, this is what we’ve been looking for,” but they didn’t come. I mean, they might have visited, come for a lecture, but they didn’t come forward. Maybe they weren’t sincere and serious enough. So, I don’t know if I answered your question but, I mean, usually, with people whose family members are not devotees, I give them two advices. One is, they should be very happy, and the other is, they should deal very nicely with their family members and everyone. If people see that they’re happy and that they deal nicely with them and with others then that will be the best recommendation for Krishna consciousness. Because quite often, you can’t exactly preach to your family members. But if they see you are happy and if they see you’re treating them nicely and dealing with others nicely, they’ll be impressed with this Krishna consciousness.

Krishna Kirtan Prabhu: Thank you, Maharaja.

Speaker: Vishnugada Prabhu has a question.

Devotee: Thank you so much, Giriraj Maharaja, for sharing your personal, intimate development with Srila Prabhupada, it’s very joyable. Just a question, when will your book about Juhu be available?

Giriraj Swami: Well, it’s written, and even the back matter is finished. The only thing left is the general index, and we’re in the final stages of the general index. Otherwise, it’s basically ready. But with the coronavirus, I’m not sure when it will be printed, because the book will be printed by the Australian BBT under Devamrita Swami, and Devamrita Swami wanted to ask the other BBT divisions how many copies they wanted so they could get in on the print run. But he felt that with the coronavirus pandemic, their consciousness is preoccupied. And I also agreed, it really is not the right time to ask them, because everyone feels so much uncertainty now.

And I was planning, but I don't know what’s going to happen now. I was planning to go to India in October and release the book there, have the launch in India in October, and I don’t know what’s going to happen with my travels to India. But probably within a few days or a week at most, the general index, which is the only part that’s still pending, will be finished. Thank you for asking.

Speaker: We have another question from Sita devi dasi.

Sita devi dasi: Hare Krishna, Maharaja, thank you so much for sharing your wonderful story, it’s very, very, very inspiring. I keep imagining how it must have been when Srila Prabhupada was on the planet and you got personal association with him, that’s very, very touching. In your journey so far, and the reason I’m asking this question is because I’m very fallen, I have a lot of problems. So, in your journey so far, did you ever have a period of time or a moment where you had struggles being in the movement?

Giriraj Swami: Well, I will share with you an exchange I had with Srila Prabhupada in Calcutta in 1971 at the time of the first Calcutta pandal. I said to Srila Prabhupada, “Now you are here so everything is good. But what if in the future when you are not here, ISKCON falls from the standard. What should I do?” And Srila Prabhupada replied, “You are also one of the important members of the society, so you work for the improvement, but don’t leave.” I mean, I didn’t really consider myself to be an important member of the society then, but I have always kept that instruction in my heart, “You work for the correction, but don’t leave.” So, it was never an option for me to leave.

I think of another exchange with Srila Prabhupada now, with Bhakti Svarupa Damodara Swami Maharaja, who told him, “Srila Prabhupada, I have just one department, the BI, the Bhaktivedanta Institute, and I have to deal with so many problems. And you have the whole worldwide movement. I can’t even imagine how many problems you have to deal with.” And Srila Prabhupada replied, “Problems? I don’t see any problems. I see only service to my Guru Maharaja.” So, from that perspective, it’s all service.

I mean, of course, there have been different kinds of difficulties. One was, I had cardiac bypass surgery, and I fell sixty-three days of rounds behind. I mean, there were many, many days when I couldn’t chant at all, and then even afterwards, when I was feeling a little better, I could chant some rounds but not sixteen. So, I kept falling further and further behind. So eventually, it came to the sixty-three days of rounds behind, but I made them up, I kept track and I made them up. And I do think that is an important principle, to chant our sixteen rounds, and if we miss, to make them up.

I think it’s just Srila Prabhupada’s mercy that’s been keeping me going all this time. Frankly, I think that’s the only thing, and the association of well-wishing devotees. And I also want to thank you because you were so helpful on my visit last time with the books and DVDs and everything, so helpful. I’m so pleased and grateful to you for your help.

Sita devi dasi: I am a nobody. I have my struggles. I don’t want anyone to think I’m thinking of leaving the movement, I just had a friend who left his body and left the movement that way, and he was a very sincere devotee, and I’m struggling with that portion of it.

Giriraj Swami: Oh, in New Vrindavan?

Sita devi dasi: Yes.

Giriraj Swami: Yeah, that’s a very tragic story. We’re praying for him.

Sita devi dasi: Thank you, Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna.

Speaker: [Unintelligible 01:37:54] Prabhu, you had your hand up, and then you may have left, I’m not sure. Are you there?

Giriraj Swami: I see him.

Speaker: Okay, great, he’s there. [Unintelligible 01:38:01] Prabhu?

Devotee: Yes, can you hear me?

Giriraj Swami: Yes.

Devotee: Maharaja, please accept my humble obeisances, all glories to Srila Prabhupada, all glories to you. Maharaja, I tell you that when I listen to your story, often people tell their stories and it’s nice to hear, but I was there, you took me on your journey with you and I so appreciated that. I think many of us, we have a journey, we were trying. But it was so nice when you carried us there, and you also spoke of the specialness of finally finding Srila Prabhupada. And I just love hearing that, how it happened. And I don’t know what to say. It was such a wonderful, wonderful journey. I wonder if at any point, just like you’re telling the story tonight, are there times when you reflect on the fact that you found him? And what is that reflection? Because you were looking for broken, cut glass and finding diamonds. So, I just wonder what your thoughts are sometimes when you think about the fact that you didn’t only find your guru, but who you found?

Giriraj Swami: How did I feel?

Devotee: Mainly that you found Srila Prabhupada.

Giriraj Swami: It’s interesting that you mentioned Dhruva Maharaja because when he went into the forest to get his kingdom, and then he found God, and the Lord asked him if he wanted any boon, he said, “No, no. I was searching for a piece of broken glass and I found the most valuable jewel.” I mean, I mentioned sort of indirectly that I was always in the mood to serve people. First, I thought as a doctor, and then I thought as a psychologist.

So, one of the first days with Srila Prabhupada, I asked the question, “I’ve heard from you about service to God, the importance of service to God, but what about service to man? Where does the service to man fit in?” And then, he quoted the story of Dhruva Maharaja. And at the end, when God asked him to accept some boon, Dhruva replied, “Svāmin kṛtārtho ‘smi varaṁ na yāce. My dear Lord, I’m fully satisfied, I do not want any benediction from you.” And then, Srila Prabhupada said, “So, to give people something that they’re so satisfied they don’t want anything more in life, is that not service to man?” And he said, ‘When you’re fully satisfied, you have no more desires, no more pickpocketing.”

So, that phrase, “Pickpocketing,” really sort of resonated with me because I was a very honest person, but I guess a friend of mine sort of turned me on to maybe not exactly pickpocketing, what we would say, but shoplifting, you go into a shop and you get some small items, put them in your pocket. So, when Srila Prabhupada said, “No more pickpocketing,” I thought, Wow, I’ve been doing that, I’ve been pickpocketing. No more pickpocketing now, just depend on Krishna, be satisfied with what Krishna provides. So, I’m so indebted to Srila Prabhupada on every level.

Devotee: Thank you, thank you. Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: Thank you, thank you.

Speaker: We have Dr. Brittney Anderson. She has a question.

Giriraj Swami: Yes?

Dr. Brittney Anderson: Hare Krishna, Maharaja. I wanted to ask about a famous sloka. I had some unclarity about the sloka, Chapter Nine, Verse Twenty-Six, the one regarding, “If one, with love and devotion, offers me a leaf, a flower, or a little water, I will accept it.”

Today after ārati, I went for prasādam today. We are finally open at the Detroit temple. And I had mentioned that sloka, and someone had mentioned to me, not any leaf, it has to be a tulasi leaf. And I thought, Well, in the sloka it just says leaf, just any leaf. And they said, “No, it must be a tulasi leaf because tulasi is a dear devotee of Lord Krishna.” So, can you clarify this sloka for me? Does it have to be a tulasi leaf? Thank you.

Giriraj Swami: Well, of course, tulasi is preferred by Krishna, but I never took it that the verse meant only tulasi. There was one incident, it was during the struggle for the Juhu land, and Srila Prabhupada was staying at a life member’s home, not quite completed, in the Juhu development scheme, which was maybe a mile from the temple. But one morning, he was speaking with some of the senior devotees and supporters about the difficulties and how to solve them, and suddenly, this laborer, I mean, you could see he had a very dark complexion, muscular, and he had just a little white cloth around his waist, sort of faded white.

And so, he just suddenly appeared at the door, and Prabhupada was on the second floor. He suddenly appeared at the door, he walked right up to Srila Prabhupada, and he presented him a collection of flowers and leaves, and he bowed down and walked out. And Srila Prabhupada was so moved, he was choked up and he couldn’t speak for a few moments, and then he quoted that verse, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ, and he said, “Even Krishna is moved by a simple offering, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ. And so, what to speak of me? I’m just an insignificant living entity.” So, he thought of that verse when that laborer offered him the leaves and flowers. I’m pretty sure there was no tulasi among those leaves, but Srila Prabhupada was still very touched by the offering.

Dr. Brittney Anderson: Thank You, Maharaja.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna.

Dr. Brittney Anderson: Hare Krishna.

Speaker: Maharaja, we have a couple more hands up. How are you doing as far as time?

Giriraj Swami: Well, I have all the time in the world. [laughter]

Speaker: Okay. Radha Vallabha Prabhu, you’re next.

Giriraj Swami: Hare Krishna, Radha Vallabha. Hare Krishna, Srimati.

Speaker: Can you unmute yourself?

Giriraj Swami: He seems to be unmuted but he’s not speaking. Radha Vallabha Prabhu, please speak.

Devotee: So, may I speak on his behalf, Maharaja?

Giriraj Swami: Sure.

Devotee: I just don’t really have a question, Maharaja, I have a couple of comments.

Giriraj Swami: Sure.

Devotee: I recently completed reading your book, Watering the Seed. Beautiful, beautiful book. And when you were speaking, Maharaja, it felt like everything was before our eyes and we were with you when you were experiencing all those events and being with Srila Prabhupada, how you got his mercy. And coming from your mouth, it felt really amazing. So, thank you for sharing that story with us today. And also, thank you for writing the books that you do Maharaja. I also am reading Many Moons these days, and that’s a beautiful book about the departed souls of pure devotees and about introducing us to their contributions and how we should be thankful for the pure devotees, that they made Krishna consciousness for us available.

Giriraj Swami: I might add, just before this program began, Mother Sangita informed me that today is the anniversary of the disappearance of HH Bhakti Tirtha Swami, who was one of the figures in the book Many Moons. So, if you’re going to be reading Many Moons this evening, you could maybe read about HH Bhakti Tirtha Swami Maharaja.

Speaker: What a coincidence, Maharaja, I am on Bhakti Tirtha Swami these days and I am reading about when he had a dream about Srila Prabhupada and he instructed him to go to South Africa to preach among South African devotees and increase the movement there.

Giriraj Swami: Oh, perfect.

Devotee: And another comment I have, recently, there was a Vyasa-puja for Indradyumna Maharaja, and there was a little picture of you and Indradyumna Maharaja in Vrindavan. It felt to me that it probably was taken after a parikramā because you looked very tired, with a very blissful smile on both of you and your hands together, I think Indradyumna Maharaja was holding you from the shoulder. So, it was a beautiful picture, you two seemed like two gopas in Vrindavan looking at Krishna. So, I just wanted to share that with you.

Giriraj Swami: Nice, very nice. Yeah, that’s true, it was his Vyasa-puja recently. Thank you.

Speaker: Maharaja, we have a question from a 646 number, no name there, but they can speak. Okay, we’ll come back to them. Manjari?

Giriraj Swami: Unmute yourself, Manajri. I mean, it says Manjari, she’s actually Manjari’s mother.

Devotee: Hare Krishna, I’m Nityasakhi , Guru Maharaja, I’m using my daughter’s ID.

Giriraj Swami: I know.

Devotee: Guru Maharaja, I had one question. When you joined Srila Prabhupada, when you heard him and when you went and told your parents that you have to join the temple, was it easy for you to immediately join, or did it take some time for you to become a full-time devotee?

Giriraj Swami: Well, I would say it didn’t take me time, but it took them time. Because I joined right before my graduation. And I asked the devotees, “Should I continue?” There was maybe a month left. And they said, “Yes, you should graduate, it might be good in the future.” So, I would go back to the campus, and I was so enthusiastic about Krishna consciousness, I hardly spoke about the studies. I was just telling my classmates about Krishna consciousness.

But when the exams came, I mean, it’s as if whatever answers I knew, those questions were on the exam. And there was one question about evolution. So, I was repeating the theory of evolution, and I thought, Oh my god, I’m missing something, there’s something I haven’t got. But then I got an A for that exam, and then I realized the defect was not in my understanding of the theory, the defect was in the theory itself, it didn’t really hold together.

But yes, I graduated and my parents came for the graduation. And I don’t know how much I told them before they came, but it was a shock, it was a shock. And in those days, I mean, we would all do menial service and I was very new. So, part of my service was peeling the potatoes in the kitchen. And my father said, “I spent all this money to put you through the university and now you’re peeling potatoes?” But yeah, my mother, we did some chanting in the park, my mother sort of danced with the devotees.

But my grandmother was going to come, it was a big thing because I was the first grandchild graduating from the university, but they told her not to come. I don’t know what excuse they gave, because they knew it would have been hard on her. But she would. . . I don’t know if all grandmothers or more so Jewish grandmothers, but they get together and they talk about what their grandchildren are doing. So, she didn’t exactly say that I was a Hare Krishna devotee in India, but she said I’m in India writing a book. And now her words are coming true because all of that culminated in the book about Srila Prabhupada in Juhu. So, it’s true I was in India working on a book.

Speaker: Thank you very much. Maharaja, we’re about to reach the two-hour mark here, in the East Coast it’s 9:30. Now, what we’re thinking is maybe we wrap up this session. There are a couple more people, I’m sure there are more people that may want to ask questions, but we’d like to let everybody know that you’ll be back with us in Philadelphia and in Delaware to do another program with us next Saturday, June 20th, for the observance of the disappearance days of Gadadhara Pandita and Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura. So, Krishna Kirtan, do you want to give some closing remarks to Maharaja?

Krishna Kirtan Prabhu: Thank you. Maharaja, I’m very, very grateful for your association. I was feeling so saddened that finally, you wanted to come, we were so excited, but it didn’t work out. But here, you offered online, and that helped a lot, many people could join and little time from you is very valuable. . . What did Dronacharya Prabhu say? June?

Speaker: June 20th, next Saturday. Same time, 7:30. Same Zoom channel.

Speaker: Thank you on behalf of Krishna Village and ISKCON Philadelphia, we want to thank you.  Thank you, and we’re looking forward to your association again. And also, all the godbrothers, Vishnugada Prabhu, Mother Sangita. And I want to thank you for joining as well. Thank you, Maharaja. Hare Krishna.

Giriraj Swami: Thank you. Hare Krishna.

Speaker: Thank you everyone for joining, please save the date for the next event. Haribol. Thank you.

Speaker: Love you, Maharaja!

Speaker: Haribol Maharaja, thank you so much.

Giriraj Swami: Yes, we should end with Vaishnava praṇāma, that’s a very good idea.

Speaker: Everyone please unmute. Mataji, please unmute everyone.

Giriraj Swami: Let us offer our respectful obeisances unto the Vaishnava devotees of the Lord. They are just like desire trees and can fulfill the desires of everyone, and they are full of compassion for the fallen conditioned souls.

vāñchā-kalpa-tarubhyaś ca
kṛpā-sindhubhya eva ca
patitānāṁ pāvanebhyo
vaiṣṇavebhyo namo namaḥ